Hopping techniques

[zgoda]

My usual approach is large flameout/whirlpool addition then leave wort overnight with hops. The aroma I get from this is far more stable than from dry hopping.

Interesting, do you use a "sealed" no chill cube or similar?

No, turn on cooling, when temp reaches 80c add hops, chill to 40-50c and then left boiler with lid on overnight outside. Rack to fv on the morning.

[gnutz2]

My usual approach is large flameout/whirlpool addition then leave wort overnight with hops. The aroma I get from this is far more stable than from dry hopping.

Interesting, do you use a "sealed" no chill cube or similar?

No, turn on cooling, when temp reaches 80c add hops, chill to 40-50c and then left boiler with lid on overnight outside. Rack to fv on the morning.

I do this to save water, my IC has a lot to be desired.

Beer sitting on hops overnight cant be a bad thing.

I must say i prefer the flavour and aroma of hot steeped hops over dry hopping.

[Clibit]

Interesting that some people prefer steeping to dry hopping and some prefer dry hopping. I read about a test someone did which concluded that half the aroma hops steeped and half dry hopped worked out best in their opinion. Best of both worlds.

[raiderman]

Interesting that some people prefer steeping to dry hopping and some prefer dry hopping. I read about a test someone did which concluded that half the aroma hops steeped and half dry hopped worked out best in their opinion. Best of both worlds.

I think the flavour is different. So both approaches have their merit. I think dry hopping can be more assertive and slightly green resins in taste until they bed in. You could argue a combination gets the best of both worlds. My excuse for soakings at 80c and chucking some in the cornie is that I can have a swig when kegging and if I'm not happy I can chuck some more in at that point.

[dreadskin69]

I started playing around with different timings for different styles but always found hop flavour was wanting more. I fwh, then add loads at 15,10,5, cool to 80 by adding cold water and add another load in and leave it for an hour and a half. I then add a wack of dry hop. I feel you get every layer of the hop aroma. I fwh because it's handy, and I can use less for more, and was intrigued by claims of aroma and a more rounded bitterness.I Now do this for my pale and ipa

[jaroporter]

I fwh because it's handy, and I can use less for more

how do you mean? FWH usually requires more hops for the same bitterness level as a 60min addition. or do you mean that the better flavour allows you to latehop less?

[dreadskin69]

beersmith says use less for bittering to get more outta your hop, both bitter wise and aroma wise. i never use less aroma hops, only more! as for bittering, everything i have read says u get better isomeration out of fwh, so more bitter for less hop. in fairness i cant tell anymore cus all bar my first brew have been fwhopped

[scuppeteer]

I fwh because it's handy, and I can use less for more

how do you mean? FWH usually requires more hops for the same bitterness level as a 60min addition. or do you mean that the better flavour allows you to latehop less?

I wait to be corrected but FWH you would generally use less as the IBU ratio increases the longer you have the hops sitting in hot wort. When I FWH I base it on a 90min addition so I can calculate more accurately. I find FWH gives a softer/rounder bitterness profile which sits much better in certain types of beer, especially if you are brewing a heavily hopped or stronger style.

[seymour]

how do you mean? FWH usually requires more hops for the same bitterness level as a 60min addition. or do you mean that the better flavour allows you to latehop less?

I wait to be corrected but FWH you would generally use less as the IBU ratio increases the longer you have the hops sitting in hot wort. When I FWH I base it on a 90min addition so I can calculate more accurately. I find FWH gives a softer/rounder bitterness profile which sits much better in certain types of beer, especially if you are brewing a heavily hopped or stronger style.

+1

I'm with you as usual, Scupps. Lately, I've been adding my bittering hops to my empty boil kettle, then draining the mash/lauter tun straight onto them, which means they soak for awhile before being brought to a boil, so needless to say, they're still in there for the full boil. That's what I call "First Wort Hops" but maybe that's not exactly what everyone means. Used thus, I've never understood the arguments about needing more hops, or the hops somehow produce fewer IBUs than the same quantity of hops added later, once the wort comes to a boil. What're they talking about? Really, my ears are open.

Can I tell a difference in the final beer? To be 100% honest, I don't know for sure. I'd like to believe it's a smoother bitterness, but maybe it's all mental. It's definitely not less bitter, though. How could it be, the hops are there for the full boil plus some?

[mysterio]

I think the argument is that some of the bitterness gets bound up during hot break formation. I know, right?

I don't think i've ever intentionally FWH so I can't comment.

[mysterio]

I think the argument is that some of the bitterness gets bound up during hot break formation. I know, right?

I don't think i've ever intentionally FWH so I can't comment.

[jaroporter]

i think the argument/research behind that view is that the percieved bitterness (that is not to say actual) is lower with FWH, due to the softer/smoother bittering, and portrays roughly equivalent to that of a 20min addition. leading to some brewing software calulating it as a 20min addition. guess that's where my interest to hear otherwise was, as i'll agree basic logic dictates that the longer they boil for the more bitterness you get. though maybe treating them hops real nice and gently warming them as opposed to thermal shocking them does do something odd. there's alot of science out there i ain't even gonna try to understand :p
i do FWH as i like the idea of the hops steeping in the wort as it comes to boil, but i'll admit i've not done my own side-by-side comparism of bitterness..

[Clibit]

Interesting thread on the FWH/Hopstand subject from people who seem to be experienced...

http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/f ... ic=17331.0

[jaroporter]

funnily enough i've just seen a Q&A with Stan Hieronymus on brewersfriend where they suggest they are thinking of changing their calculation of FW hops away from 20min, and he suggests 75 minutes..

[pantsmachine]

My version of FWH is a load of whole hops into the dry kettle then run a couple of Gallons of wort onto them and fire up the gas burner while continuing the sparge bringing the whole lot to the boil and then finishing the sparge. This has become my established practice as i perceived a smoothness in my beer that was lacking when i just horsed my hops into a rolling boil. Could have been the placebo effect but it wasn't just me that noticed it.

As has been said before it really is each to their own in this but to get a non-vegetative hop aroma/flavour i personally stick with FWH and a load of flame out hops going in at around 80 and the whole wort being recirculated a few times over the 90 minutes it takes my copper immersion cooler to pull 15 gallons down to sub 30.

I also have a dry hopping circulation device once the wort is in and has fermented for a couple of days and that adds a layer as does dry hopping and squeezing yer bags! :0

I hear and agree what is being said regarding skimming at the beginning of the boil so i guess its one or the other regarding FWH and protein skimming? Oh yeah, there is also hop blitzing which i will be trying in my next IPA. Many ways to defur the feline.