Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

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WalesAles
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Re: Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

Post by WalesAles » Sun May 05, 2013 12:13 pm

Sounds good, please keep us updated on the Brew!
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Re: Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

Post by WalesAles » Tue Aug 13, 2013 11:41 am

winka wrote:I have my beer 3 weeks in the primary fv, might have been oak overkill for that long and wanted to try a week for first go
Cheers :wink:
Hello Winka,
How was your Brew? Found 2 bottles Of Vintage Oak Chipped TC in my Brother`s yesterday, they were bottled on 10th May. Tasted very nice though we couldn`t really taste the Oak Chips, perhaps I should have put more in the Brew and left it for longer?
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Re: Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

Post by Normski » Thu Sep 12, 2013 3:18 pm

winka wrote:Afternoon chaps, I've just ordered medium and heavy toast oak chips from online to oak some wines and ales.However can you use the oak chips that you buy for bbq's or are there reasons not to? My local B&Q do some jack Daniels ones at 1 kilo for 8 pound, made from old jd barrels. Would work out a lot cheaper than the 400g and p+p which came to over a tenner
Cheers :wink:
Hi winka
i have been useing those JD bbq chips from B&Q for a few years. I find they are far better than any of the oak chips from LHBS.
I use them for spirit, not beer or wine. If they are dusty, you may need to wash them before use.
They can be used over many times, then when no longer needed, just dry them out and use them on your BBQ.
Norm
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fatbloke

Re: Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

Post by fatbloke » Thu Sep 12, 2013 8:24 pm

Damn ! You cider and beer people have a lot to learn about oak (I know just enough to be dangerous).......

3 primary sources for cooperage quality oak. Northern US, France and Hungarian (yes other places too, but those 3 are considered best). Origin plays a big part, as does level of toasting.

Personally, I just get a barrel half from the garden centre, one thats dried out too much and they're gonna bin......

Remove the hoops and head, trim the ends to clean wood with a saw, then plane down to clean wood on the other sides with a lecky plane.

Cut into about 5 to 6 inch lengths, then split them down so the sticks are about 5mm square.

Into a low oven for a couple of hours until the clean wood is the colour of darkish pencil lead/graphite.

Bingo. Home made oak flavouring sticks. Proper white oak of cooperage quality, etc etc....

Add a couple per gallon and leave for a couple of weeks to a month, then taste. If right, remove, not enough ? add more and leave longer.....

Start low and work up - good. Start too much - a fools errand.....

Ribbit

Re: Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

Post by Ribbit » Sun Oct 06, 2013 10:15 am

I just go to my local timber merchant (I used to supply him with my custom designed copper nails and other roofing supplies years ago - favours do get remembered and returned *grins*) and get otherwise useless small oak offcuts for free. Wash them, split them with an axe, cut to length, and grill them.

I shove a few in a bottle with a spoon of honey, to make the absolute rubbish that's put into Scottish whisky bottles these days just about drinkable (though I must admit the quality has become so bad - bulk wide spectrum ultra cheap distilling from the same source has a uniformly disgusting flavour due to inclusions of extremely unsavoury rapid brewed esters, and it is turning up in just about everything, even in export product - that I have stopped buying it due to the practice being absolutely fraudulent and too scandalous for words, and now make my own instead. legally. with a still).

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Re: Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

Post by Normski » Sun Oct 06, 2013 12:21 pm

Hi Ribbit
I'd keep that a bit quiet if I was you. Legal, are you sure?
It's also something that is not discused on this forum.
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Re: Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

Post by TC2642 » Sun Oct 06, 2013 1:30 pm

I've got 50gms of French oak chips soaking in Teachers, forgot that I had made it in April 2012. Planning to add it to a Porter of around 6% that I shall be making shortly.
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Re: Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

Post by Pinto » Sun Oct 06, 2013 2:23 pm

Ribbit doesnt mention where in the world he is - there are actually enlightened, non money-grabbing countries in the world who allow home distillation (or dare I say it, allow it with a REASONABLY priced licence....) He could quite easily be legal :)

However, This is a UK centred forum so agreed, lets not upset the lovely duty man and his wonderful charges by further discussion ;)

Must look into this oaking game myself, as I'd love to make an Innes & Gunn clone
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Re: Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

Post by Ribbit » Mon Oct 07, 2013 6:36 pm

Normski wrote:Hi Ribbit
I'd keep that a bit quiet if I was you. Legal, are you sure?
It's also something that is not discused on this forum.
Absolutely positive, I actually listened to the debate in Parliament in 1979.

Can talk to HMRC if you like (I know people that have recently), but they are a bit prone to making it up as they go along these days (rather naughty of them, and they have had their wrists seriously slapped in Court by a friend recently, because of it). They presently insist on a still of 5ltrs capacity maximum, and try and say that you need a licence off them, but that licence is free for personal distillers. For personal use, a 5ltr still is certainly good enough.

There was no requirement for a licence for personal use distilling in the 1979 legislation (so HMRC are just being awkward and petty jobsworths), the 1979 arrangement changes were for easing of licencing for minimum sized commercial large stills, to help new production, and freeing up personal use stills (putting them on a similar basis as personal tobacco growing). I was rather surprised that these important changes didn't get a lot of coverage at the time (I think it was only Radio 4's Yesterday in Parliament that gave it adequate coverage)

If the forum wishes to delete such information in these posts, they are quite welcome, but it is still (grin) perfectly legal.

As an aside, my main use presently is purchasing tax paid commercial cider (so HMRC definitely get their share of any taxes already), and checking how high strength ciders are made, due to being suspicious of the effects on people of a couple of 7.5% products. I have found some get the high strength by using low strength cider, and adding METHANOL to what looks to be cheap cider of around 3.5%, to bring it up to 7.5% 'alcohol' content (unfortunately safe Ethanol and unsafe Methanol, are 'both' alcohol, so the 7.5% alcohol on the label is technically, but dangerously, correct), with the actual Ethanol content being in line with a cider of around 3.5%. I am getting about 500% the normal amount of Methanol that is in 'properly' brewed cider. I have checked a lot of 5% ciders so far, and all the ones I have tested have the normal ratio of Methanol (too low to worry about). Some own brand 5% ciders are very good with their low Methanol content, and have provided me with good reference points (and pretty darned good apple brandy).

It is crimes like this, that HMRC and the Serious Fraud Squad (or equivalent), along with consumer protection, should be investigating.

If money allows, next, I will be taking a long hard look at whiskey, which is definitely having appalling stuff put into bottles (I hope no Methanol, but there definitely seems to be over fast fermentation and broad spectrum rushed distillation, with off flavours that should be excluded, destroying quality), which is even ending up in export product. I should find zero Methanol content in any bottle of commercial spirits. Fingers crossed that will be the case, otherwise the implications are worse than disturbing (and in line with the distillation practices that were carried on under the Soviet Union, where 'good' alcohol was restricted to Party members, and the Methanol in 'cheap spirits for the masses' resulted in massive problems across places like Eastern Europe, a legacy that is still having consequences, to this day).

Eventually, I hope to be able to hand a useful report in to the relevant Police and Consumer Protection bodies, should it prove necessary.

eta: I think the facility offered for truly independent testing and a 'watchdog role', are important enough reasons on their own for legality for personal distillation, that can act as a really useful check against malpractice in the drinks industry. Simply put, how else can anybody check?
Last edited by Ribbit on Mon Oct 07, 2013 6:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

WalesAles
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Re: Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

Post by WalesAles » Sat Oct 19, 2013 8:56 pm

Hello Everybody,
My brother just texted me that he found a bottle of Cider marked OC in the back of his fridge. One of mine, Oak Chips bottled 10/5/13. He said it was a fantastic cider, lovely taste but he could not pin it down to any particular taste. When I told him Oak Chips, he said `Mmm, I dunno, something there but not Oak`. Oh well, he enjoyed it, he said `It`s Bloody Lovely Mun!`
WA

bob3000

Re: Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

Post by bob3000 » Sun Oct 20, 2013 8:02 am

Ribbit wrote:
Normski wrote:Hi Ribbit
I'd keep that a bit quiet if I was you. Legal, are you sure?
It's also something that is not discused on this forum.
Absolutely positive, I actually listened to the debate in Parliament in 1979.

Can talk to HMRC if you like (I know people that have recently), but they are a bit prone to making it up as they go along these days (rather naughty of them, and they have had their wrists seriously slapped in Court by a friend recently, because of it). They presently insist on a still of 5ltrs capacity maximum, and try and say that you need a licence off them, but that licence is free for personal distillers. For personal use, a 5ltr still is certainly good enough.

There was no requirement for a licence for personal use distilling in the 1979 legislation (so HMRC are just being awkward and petty jobsworths), the 1979 arrangement changes were for easing of licencing for minimum sized commercial large stills, to help new production, and freeing up personal use stills (putting them on a similar basis as personal tobacco growing). I was rather surprised that these important changes didn't get a lot of coverage at the time (I think it was only Radio 4's Yesterday in Parliament that gave it adequate coverage)

If the forum wishes to delete such information in these posts, they are quite welcome, but it is still (grin) perfectly legal.

As an aside, my main use presently is purchasing tax paid commercial cider (so HMRC definitely get their share of any taxes already), and checking how high strength ciders are made, due to being suspicious of the effects on people of a couple of 7.5% products. I have found some get the high strength by using low strength cider, and adding METHANOL to what looks to be cheap cider of around 3.5%, to bring it up to 7.5% 'alcohol' content (unfortunately safe Ethanol and unsafe Methanol, are 'both' alcohol, so the 7.5% alcohol on the label is technically, but dangerously, correct), with the actual Ethanol content being in line with a cider of around 3.5%. I am getting about 500% the normal amount of Methanol that is in 'properly' brewed cider. I have checked a lot of 5% ciders so far, and all the ones I have tested have the normal ratio of Methanol (too low to worry about). Some own brand 5% ciders are very good with their low Methanol content, and have provided me with good reference points (and pretty darned good apple brandy).

It is crimes like this, that HMRC and the Serious Fraud Squad (or equivalent), along with consumer protection, should be investigating.

If money allows, next, I will be taking a long hard look at whiskey, which is definitely having appalling stuff put into bottles (I hope no Methanol, but there definitely seems to be over fast fermentation and broad spectrum rushed distillation, with off flavours that should be excluded, destroying quality), which is even ending up in export product. I should find zero Methanol content in any bottle of commercial spirits. Fingers crossed that will be the case, otherwise the implications are worse than disturbing (and in line with the distillation practices that were carried on under the Soviet Union, where 'good' alcohol was restricted to Party members, and the Methanol in 'cheap spirits for the masses' resulted in massive problems across places like Eastern Europe, a legacy that is still having consequences, to this day).

Eventually, I hope to be able to hand a useful report in to the relevant Police and Consumer Protection bodies, should it prove necessary.

eta: I think the facility offered for truly independent testing and a 'watchdog role', are important enough reasons on their own for legality for personal distillation, that can act as a really useful check against malpractice in the drinks industry. Simply put, how else can anybody check?
Nod and smile...

and back away quietly

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Re: Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

Post by Normski » Thu Oct 24, 2013 9:14 am

:roll:
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Re: Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

Post by Nunez100 » Thu Dec 05, 2013 8:51 am

How many times can you re-use the chips? Do they 'run out' of flavor?

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Re: Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

Post by Normski » Thu Dec 05, 2013 9:50 am

Nunez100 wrote:How many times can you re-use the chips? Do they 'run out' of flavor?
Yes they can be reused many times, But any flavour from previous alcohol will eventually fade.
The real beauty is in th Oak itself.
They can be dried out and flamed with a blow torch.
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Re: Oak chips, can you use BBQ smoking chips?

Post by Nunez100 » Fri Dec 06, 2013 1:34 am

Cheers, will give it a go.

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