Finings and dry hopping

[Scooby]

Personally I'd go with Aux only as it seems to work for fuse

that was a couple of years ago and I wasn't using anywhere as much hops as I do now, how
times and tastes change!

So how do you use the hops and how much. I am finding aroma disappointing in brews that are not dry hopped and even then we are talking a lot of hops. My preferred method is in the fermenter but racking is a problem if the're loose and in a hop bag I wonder if they are exposed enough to the beer?

Loads of hops added at 15mins or less, I get all my IBU's from them or if I want more bitterness I add a small amount
of Warrior or Columbus for 60 mins, but not much. Loads more added at 80c and steeped for 40mins and like
you I dry hop in the fermenter with loose pellets when the fermentation is slow, I leave for 7day min before racking.
They just sink but may need a gentle stir occasionally to help them.

In 10gal brews I add whatever I need to the boil to get the planned IBU, depending on the hops it might be as little as 150g
up to 250g. Steep is about 100-200g and 50-120g in the fermenter although I have added 300g once. I prefer pellets
so use them but some whole hops when I can't get pellets.

Adding hops late only, is it called hop bursting? has the advantage in that all the additions contribute to flavour and aroma
as apposed to the traditional way of bittering for 60-90mins and just adding a few late hops, although having enjoyed some
Steel City and Magic Rock beers recently I'm going to try chucking loads of hops in at both ends, as the Steel City beers are
never less than 100IBU no matter what the strength.

This article from Vinnie Cilurzo of Russian River suggests there's quiet a connection between yeast and hop flavour/aroma. I'm not qualified to argue one way or another but this lad knows hoppy beers

I agree with him on the crystal, I like pale hoppy beers and rarely use malts darker than 30EBC, I certainly wouldn't use any Crystal
in a hoppy beer.

Some yeasts have a flavour profile suited to hoppy beers but I'm not sure where he's coming from regarding dry hopping and surface area?

[Spud395]

I'm not arguing at all Scooby, it's just an article I thaught fitted in here. I'm not brewing super hoppy beers all that long, although my latest 2.8% baby beer (final runnings) hopped to 85 IBU is a bit of an eye opener

[orlando]

Scooby, rcommend this video on hops and hop usage. Has some interesting & surprising ideas on late hopping, steeping and dry hopping.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qD17ZeTSsE

[pantsmachine]

I do use a bit of crystal now and then in hoppy beers and it does not take away anything from the beer, in fact I find it adds a balance but then again your 40IBU IPA won’t need it whereas my 80 or 120 IBU IPA most certainly will!

I would suggest that the less yeast in the beer portion of the article means less of a coating of yeast on the hop flower and thus more surface area of the hop flower exposed to the beer. That’s a bit too much obsessive detailing for me but there you go, eh!

I personally don't use anything beyond Protafloc in my beers for clarification, just gravity and time before bottling BUT if i did feel a cosmetic spruce up was required i'd go filtration to strip the yeast out. That's what the big boys do and I like a less is more approach to what I put into my beers.

There is no way to keep a hoppy beer hoppy for an extended period of time without adding more dry hops (impossible when bottled). It changes all the time and the hop aroma/presence decreases in favour of the malt so from a time POV i guess filtration and the balance in recipe development between IBU and aroma hops is critical.

Personally i'll drink them hazy and full of hops or dropped bright after a year with more of a malt presence, it's all good! I have come to realise that basically there is no way around massive flame out hop additions and Dry hopping in your own particular style if you are after a really hoppy beer.

Sorry, what was the question?


If I wanted to keep it really simple then I guess I’d hoy a muslin bag full of hops into the fv and let it sit there for a month while the beer dropped bright(ish).

[Scooby]

Scooby, rcommend this video on hops and hop usage. Has some interesting & surprising ideas on late hopping, steeping and dry hopping.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qD17ZeTSsE

Yeah... things of note were 80c is too hot for steeping 50c recommended. 2 days max for dry hopping and using
high AA for shorter boil times so the veg doesn't get overcooked.

[Scooby]

although my latest 2.8% baby beer (final runnings) hopped to 85 IBU is a bit of an eye opener

That's what I like, break the rules!

I don't get this 'balance' thing so hope there's no crystal in there

[critch]

isinglas does limit shelf life i.m.e.,knocks out flavour too......

[Kev888]

Ah, another nail in the coffin then - thanks for the info Critch; I'm not prepared to do either of those just to make it look clearer.

Cheers
kev

[Nofolkandchance]

Ah, another nail in the coffin then - thanks for the info Critch; I'm not prepared to do either of those just to make it look clearer.

Cheers
kev

Kev, Im with you on the presentation side of things and thats why I regularly filter so if you want clear hoppy beer dont just write this method off, do some research.

I dry hop at cool temperatures then course filter (6microns) through a Buno Superjet. Even with course filtering the beer is still very clear with next to nothing being lost in the way of hop flvour/aroma or body. I also find it rids most if not all chill haze as well, despite what others say.

For comparison, I also have tried (trial and error ) with fine and sterile filter pads as well (1 micron and under). This strips most of the flavour and all the body out of the beer. My two pennorth worth!

[greenxpaddy]

If I wanted to keep it really simple then I guess I’d hoy a muslin bag full of hops into the fv and let it sit there for a month while the beer dropped bright(ish).

I have done this but I would advise against pulling it out when racking as it seems lots of fine hop particles are washed into the beer this way

[Kev888]

Kev, Im with you on the presentation side of things and thats why I regularly filter so if you want clear hoppy beer dont just write this method off, do some research.

I dry hop at cool temperatures then course filter (6microns) through a Buno Superjet. Even with course filtering the beer is still very clear with next to nothing being lost in the way of hop flvour/aroma or body. I also find it rids most if not all chill haze as well, despite what others say.

For comparison, I also have tried (trial and error ) with fine and sterile filter pads as well (1 micron and under). This strips most of the flavour and all the body out of the beer. My two pennorth worth!

Interesting, thanks for the info. I have in the distant past actually tried filtering but got either lots stripped out or very little difference, depending on the filters I used; I'd concluded that it was either both together or neither, and theres a lot of opinions out there that seemed to support that. But from what you say, it seems quite likely that I just didn't try the correct filter - I can't remember if I used a 6micron one or not. Really interesting. I force carbonate so wouldn't need to prime, but do you find enough yeast get through a 6micron filter for conditioning purposes?

I've completetly decided against isinglass now, so I'll see how the aux finings work out; they're dead simple and have a reasonable shelf life so have a lot going for them 'if' they work out. If for some reason they don't though, I'll re-visit filtering and see how it goes. Thanks again for the info,

Kev

[FUBAR]

I mixed up some Brupaks dried isinglass this morning to add to the brew in a few days time,well after a good half an hour in the blender all I achieved was a greyish coloured water which smelt foul(as its fish guts not suprissing I suppose)and it was really quite warm after all the time in the blender,hence its gone down the drain,
Now im trying to decide to use just aux finings and see what that does or go to the HB shop and buy some Ritchies Kwik Clear which has had some positive posts on another thread on here,one thing for sure im not letting foul smelling fish guts near my beer.

FUBAR

[orlando]

Fubar - I use Kwikclear and swear by it, completely amazing, drops bright in 24 hours, undetectable and made from amongst other things gelatine, no fish guts. Still a bit of a problem for veggies though. My last bottling session (yesterday) was a culmination of a number of things. First copper finings (Protafloc granules, superb stuff), 1/2 hour wait for trub to settle, then drained into the FV through my hop sock covered copper manifold that captures a huge amount of trub but not all the cold break, need some for the yeast!

Fermented right out then crash cooled to 5c for 48 hours. Racked off to a keg containing Kwikclear left for 24 hours then racked again to bottling bucket containing priming syrup, bottled using a bottling cane to supress oxygentaion. Looked at them this morning already bright but not quite crystal, with a thin paint like layer appearing on the bottom of the bottle, suggests enough yeast pulled through for secondary fermentation. Fully expect crystal by tomorrow, leave for 2 weeks in the warm then refridgerate to ensure proper carbonation then into the cellar (14c) to await my impatient hands grabbing one. I will report back (subject to memory lapse) once I open one.

[critch]

Ah, another nail in the coffin then - thanks for the info Critch; I'm not prepared to do either of those just to make it look clearer.

Cheers
kev

Kev, Im with you on the presentation side of things and thats why I regularly filter so if you want clear hoppy beer dont just write this method off, do some research.

I dry hop at cool temperatures then course filter (6microns) through a Buno Superjet. Even with course filtering the beer is still very clear with next to nothing being lost in the way of hop flvour/aroma or body. I also find it rids most if not all chill haze as well, despite what others say.

For comparison, I also have tried (trial and error ) with fine and sterile filter pads as well (1 micron and under). This strips most of the flavour and all the body out of the beer. My two pennorth worth!

+1 with you on sterile filtering, lots of good american micros coarse filter @10 micron with no ill effect on body or flavour,i do use fining on request, as thats what im set up for, if im brewing for myself i only use copper finings

[Scooby]

Now im trying to decide to use just aux finings and see what that does or go to the HB shop and buy some Ritchies Kwik Clear which has had some positive posts on another thread on here,one thing for sure im not letting foul smelling fish guts near my beer.

FUBAR

It's hard to choose between swim bladder and pig skin with cattle bones