mangrove jacks burton yeast

[bob3000]

According to this http://www.rebelbrewer.com/shop/dry-yea ... yeast-m79/

mangrove jacks burton union yeast is the same as WLP023 or the breakspears yeast. I used it the other week and I really like it. Even though it did get a bit warm and has a bit of banana.
The Newcastle dark ale is also nice.
I wonder where the other strains are from?

[seymour]

Thanks, I hadn't seen that connection yet.

We floated some more theories on this related thread: viewtopic.php?f=12&t=59409&hilit=mangrove#p624735

I am going to be stoked if these are truly new yeasts. And I'm not usually a nay-sayer, BUT some of the descriptions sound...familiar. For example; M07 (British Ale): med-high attenuation, high flocculation, high compaction, can ferment as low as 12C? Sounds very much like Nottingham. Although they do say it accentuates hop and malt.

M44 (US West Coast) is obviously a US05/BRY97 contender. M79 (Burton Union) sounds similar to Coopers and/or S33, M27 (Belgian Ale) sounds close to Belle Saison (mainly in terms of very high attenuation) or T58, M03 (Newcastle Dark Ale) seems close to Windsor and M10 (Workhorse) looks damn close to Mauribrew Ale 514.

That said, I am happy to be proven wrong, because the M79 sounds like a corker and even if it is just re-packed Coopers I'd be happy; I (somewhat ironically) find it difficult to find Coopers here - ditto 514. They come in kits but finding them separately is really difficult. And I like using them for a bunch of my house "running" beers.

My guess is that Mangrove Jack's US West Coast Yeast (M44) is not Chico/US-05/American Ale/Siebel Institute BRY96, but rather, the Siebel BRY97 strain "American West Coast Yeast" which may also be the original source of Wyeast 1272/White Labs WLP051/Anchor Liberty/Bell's.

I'm also guessing that Mangrove Jack's British Ale Yeast (M07) is another version of Whitbread-B. It doesn't seem to match Nottingham, and the number 07 could be another clue, since WLP007 is White Lab's version of this popular strain.

[bob3000]

rebel brewer also links thw M07 with wlp007. But I thought wlp007 was the same as nottingham!?

[bob3000]

Also I'm pretty sure M03 is not windsor as it clears really well.

[seymour]

rebel brewer also links thw M07 with wlp007. But I thought wlp007 was the same as nottingham!?

No, Nottingham is Lallemand/Danstar's own unique product, supposedly isolated from a multi-strain sample of English ale. Their single-strain yeast is a super-clean, reliable, reasonably high-attenuating and alcohol tolerant English ale strain which sticks well to the bottom of bottles, thus ticking all the important boxes for homebrewers. That's not the exact same strain, but you're right, it sounds a lot like the historic Whitbread-B strain, perhaps the first and most popular English ale yeast to be adapted to industrial-era, tall, closed cylindical-conical fermentors (as opposed to old-fashioned, shallow, open fermentors where top-croppers excelled) which is sold nowadays as S-04, White Labs WLP007, Wyeast 1098, and probably many other generic dry packets. Both Nottingham and Whitbread-B/S-04/WLP007/1098 still possess a tiny bit of English character, which ranks them higher than Chico/US-05/WLP-001/1056 in my book.

Also I'm pretty sure M03 is not windsor as it clears really well.

Yeah, the "Mangrove Jack's Newcastle Dark Ale Yeast" makes us think it's the classic Scottish and Newcastle strain used for Newcastle Brown Ale, believed to be the same sold nowadays as White Labs WLP038. The performance matches for the most part. If so, that's pretty cool, but it may not be the first time it was offered in a dry format. Some people believe the discontinued Lallemand/Danstar Manchester strain was the same thing.

[Normski]

Yeah, the "Mangrove Jack's Newcastle Dark Ale Yeast" makes us think it's the classic Scottish and Newcastle strain used for Newcastle Brown Ale, believed to be the same sold nowadays as White Labs WLP038. The performance matches for the most part. If so, that's pretty cool, but it may not be the first time it was offered in a dry format. Some people believe the discontinued Lallemand/Danstar Manchester strain was the same thing.

The Edinburgh Newcastle yeast is WLp 028.
Th WLp 038 is the Manchster strain.

Norm

[seymour]

The Edinburgh Newcastle yeast is WLp 028.
Th WLp 038 is the Manchster strain.

Are you sure?

I could certainly be wrong, but my notes indicate the Scottish & Newcastle strain is linked with the discontinued Lallemand/Danstar Manchester, White Labs WLP038, BrewLabs F40, and possibly Mangrove Jack's M03.

The White Labs WLP028 "Edinburgh Scottish Ale" performs very differently and is linked with the historic McEwans strain and Wyeast 1728 "Scottish Ale". I WISH there was a dry version of this bad boy!

[Oscar Brewer]

I used the M79 Burton yeast for a 1.042 bitter a couple of months ago and was very dissapointed. There was quite a long lag time after pitching although the brew did eventually ferment well and thoroughly. However the flocculation was very poor indeed and the beer took a long time to clear. A yeasty taste has dominated the flavour, swamping the malt and hops. On their data sheet the M79 flocculation is marked 4 out of 5 which I would assume to be medium - high. I also have the M03 Newcastle strain which I haven't used yet.

[bob3000]

The beer I made with this yeast is really malty and some of the yeast flavours are a bit much but it is mellowing well and i think it will be great after a month.
I'm looking forward to trying it in cooler weather.

[Rookie]

[/quote]
My guess is that Mangrove Jack's US West Coast Yeast (M44) is not Chico/US-05/American Ale/Siebel Institute BRY96, but rather, the Siebel BRY97 strain "American West Coast Yeast" which may also be the original source of Wyeast 1272/White Labs WLP051/Anchor Liberty/Bell's.

I'm also guessing that Mangrove Jack's British Ale Yeast (M07) is another version of Whitbread-B. It doesn't seem to match Nottingham, and the number 07 could be another clue, since WLP007 is White Lab's version of this popular strain.[/quote]

I'd really like dry versions of those two. My LHBS has the M J line, but at about 10-12% higher price, so I'd stick with S-05 if the M44 was the same strain. I've got several recipes that I use 007 on and would like a dry yeast option.

[seymour]

My guess is that Mangrove Jack's US West Coast Yeast (M44) is not Chico/US-05/American Ale/Siebel Institute BRY96, but rather, the Siebel BRY97 strain "American West Coast Yeast" which may also be the original source of Wyeast 1272/White Labs WLP051/Anchor Liberty/Bell's.

I'm also guessing that Mangrove Jack's British Ale Yeast (M07) is another version of Whitbread-B. It doesn't seem to match Nottingham, and the number 07 could be another clue, since WLP007 is White Lab's version of this popular strain.

I'd really like dry versions of those two. My LHBS has the M J line, but at about 10-12% higher price, so I'd stick with S-05 if the M44 was the same strain. I've got several recipes that I use 007 on and would like a dry yeast option.

If I understand you correctly, there might already dry versions of both yeast strains you want:

The "NBS West Coast Style" from Neale's Brewing Supplies doesn't seem exactly like Chico/US-05/American Ale/Siebel Institute BRY96, so some people guess it might be the other one I mentioned, most commonly associated with Anchor Liberty. The "BRT-97 American West Coast" dry yeast from Lallemand/Danstar is almost certainly that one.

As far as Whitbread-B/Whitbread-Dry/WLP007/Wyeast 1098, that one's even easier: Safale S-04 is a dry version of the same strain. Some people report varying results between WLP007 and S-04, and I believe them of course, but it could simply be the difference between liquid and dry, and the results of many years of micro-adaptations in different brewery environments. In any case, I've found S-04 to give decent, try-to-style English ale characteristics with a little more personality than Nottingham. Your mileage may vary.

[Rookie]

As far as Whitbread-B/Whitbread-Dry/WLP007/Wyeast 1098, that one's even easier: Safale S-04 is a dry version of the same strain. Some people report varying results between WLP007 and S-04, and I believe them of course, but it could simply be the difference between liquid and dry, and the results of many years of micro-adaptations in different brewery environments. In any case, I've found S-04 to give decent, try-to-style English ale characteristics with a little more personality than Nottingham. Your mileage may vary.

I did not know that. I use and like S-04, it makes a good bitter and is the only yeast that I'll use in my British IPA.

[leedsbrew]

Having just sampled a very simple pale I make I can say that so far I'm not take with the MJ burton strain!



With saf04 this is a great lightly citrusy cask style ale that is ready to drink within a fortnight and cracking by 4 weeks from brewday.

Now, this version is only 8 days from brewday bit it is nowhere near ready to drink. The yeast has attenuated an extra 10% more than 04, which has really dried the beer out and robbed it of some if the great malt body I like about this beer! It had a very long lag time, and is still like pea soup, whereas I would usually be seeing nearly clear beer with 04.

It has accentuated the hops more bit I definitely prefer 04 in this beer.

Anyway just my 2p

Cheers

LB

[bob3000]

the yeast flavours in mine are just settling down and i'm really enjoying it. I don't know why mine is a bit under attenuated, must be a one off.

[JKaranka]

I've used the burton union yeast and the newcastle dark.

The burton union didn't clear in a month, after which I added finings and it still didn't clear. It ended up a bit drier than what I expected and I was a bit disappointed in general. The Newcastle dark yeast, however, was absolutely brilliant in a mild. It had an attenuation of around 70%, flocculated very well, left a good malty backbone (without finishing sweet) and added some interesting esters. It didn't match the descriptions of Windsor that I've read, and it's one of those that I'll buy again. Next time I'll add a tad of sugar to increase the attenuation and give a bit more of a bite, but it's definitively a very useful yeast for milds, browns and similar.