Is this sparge temperature too low?

[guypettigrew]

For years I've heated the water for sparging to 80C. It then runs down some tubing, into a spinning sparge arm and onto the grain bed.

This morning, for no particular reason, I thought it would be interesting to measure the temperature in the top few inches of the grain bed. It was 70C.

Graham Wheeler says (in 'Brew your own British real ale') the grain bed should be 76C. Way off my figure.

My usual efficiency is about 75% or just below, using GW's 'Beer Engine' software.

Would it be a good idea to increase the sparge liquor temperature to get the grain bed up to 76C, and do you think it would increase the efficiency?

Thanks.

Guy

[Belter]

Definitely increase your temp. I aim for 75

[darkonnis]

Don't see it making any difference myself. Or rather, any measurable difference. You can sparge using cold water if you really wanted to. The idea of the sparge is to cease enzyme activity completely. This is more important when using a high mash temperature as you obviously want to keep the sweetness and body. Realistically though, it is a matter of personal choice, if you have recipes that you brew repeatedly and like how they taste then don't change it.

Only change things if there is a problem, I don't honestly see you getting a higher efficiency by using a higher sparge temp and if you've been getting 75% up until now and it hasn't bothered you, then why change?

[guypettigrew]

Cold water to sparge? An interesting idea.

I'd always assumed the sparge liquor needed to be hot to flush the sugars from the grain. Perhaps not.

Guy

[Rookie]

Cold water to sparge? An interesting idea.

I'd always assumed the sparge liquor needed to be hot to flush the sugars from the grain. Perhaps not.

Guy

I read about cold water to sparge too. It seems to me that the colder the sparge water the more you have to heat the wort back up before the boil.

[fisherman]

I fly sparge at 75oC keeping the grain bed covered at all times. I have by mistake sparged at higher temperatures without any gain and at a loss of quality in the wort.At the start of the sparge I insert a glass thermometer right to the bottom of the grain bed and the reading is 65oC to 69oC during sparge I am quite happy to leave a little malt sugar in the bed . malt is very cheap and tannins are pucker bad. By the way Guy I hope you are still brewing on a regular basis .
Happy Brewing

[hophit]

This is interesting reading. I thought it had to be 80 for the sparge too. I use a thermopot for my mash tun. I bought one of those spinning sparge arms and can never get the bloody thing to work. Basically to get it to spin, the flow rate has to be faster than I want it (thing was a waste of money imho). In the end I made a copper spiral from leftover flexible copper from making my wort chiller, drilled some tiny holes in it and hey presto have a sparge arm of sorts, that works really well. The only problem is that unlike the spinning sparge arm that went down inside the mash tun, with the copper one i have to have it at the top of the mash tun which is quite tall. The result is that that sparge water is falling quite a way before it reaches the grain bed and loses quite a lot of heat.

Now I though that the sparge water had to be 80. I have been measuring the temp at the top of the grain bed and it was reading 65/6 during sparge (so well below 80), so I was worried about ongoing unwanted mash processes. So in the end I have ended up heating the sparge liquor to almost 100 to ensure it is 80 at the top of the grain bed! Reading this, I think I won't bother about it any more and wonder if all my beers (without me realising) taste tanic to the trained palate!

[jmc]

I nearly always batch sparge.

1) Run off wort from mash
2) Add 1/2 sparge water at 86C. This normally raises mash to ~72-74C. Set HLT temp control to 80C. Leave batch for 15mins to let sugars dissolve then run off.
3) Add other 1/2 sparge water to mash at about 80-82C. Mash temp typically now 76C. Leave 15mins then run off.

I think increasing sparge water temp helps speed-up run off (less viscous), reduces chance of stuck mash and increase efficiency (a small amount)

I know many do a 2 stage batch-sparge but I'm happy doing it this way.

[gr_baker]

I suspect that the only way to stop the enzymes converting starch to sugars is in the boil. Contrary to some things I've heard they seem to be pretty tolerant of higher temperatures. As an example, most of the beers I've made recently have been lower alcohol brews mashed at 72-74C to get a good mouthfeel. I seem to get a pretty good conversion at that temperature so if you're looking for the sparge to stop conversion, I think you need to get the mash bed up to quite a high temperature.

Some years ago, in one of my first all grain brews, I messed up completely and the mash was at 79C. I got a perfectly acceptable beer and 65% efficiency out of it.

Having said that, unless you have a big delay between mash and boil, I think you don't really have to worry about further conversion. Just treat the sparge as a process to remove the extra sugars.

[Blackaddler]

For years I've heated the water for sparging to 80C. It then runs down some tubing, into a spinning sparge arm and onto the grain bed.

This morning, for no particular reason, I thought it would be interesting to measure the temperature in the top few inches of the grain bed. It was 70C.

Graham Wheeler says (in 'Brew your own British real ale') the grain bed should be 76C. Way off my figure.

My usual efficiency is about 75% or just below, using GW's 'Beer Engine' software.

Would it be a good idea to increase the sparge liquor temperature to get the grain bed up to 76C, and do you think it would increase the efficiency?

Thanks.

Guy

I don't think that you're doing anything wrong.

Did you just take a snapshot of the mash temperature, or did you monitor it throughout the entire sparge process.

I measure mash temperature continuously, somewhere in the middle of the mash.
Mash starts at 66-67C, which often falls a degree or two after 90 mins.
Sparge rate is 1L per minute.
Gravity system.

I find that initially [while recirculating] the temperature can fall to about 58-60C. A short while after sparging has started, it'll slowly start rising again. Then, towards the back end of the sparge, the temperature should have risen to about 75-ish and stay there until the sparge has finished.

Efficiency over 85%. [60L brewlength].

[Dave S]

I nearly always batch sparge.

1) Run off wort from mash
2) Add 1/2 sparge water at 86C. This normally raises mash to ~72-74C. Set HLT temp control to 80C. Leave batch for 15mins to let sugars dissolve then run off.
3) Add other 1/2 sparge water to mash at about 80-82C. Mash temp typically now 76C. Leave 15mins then run off.

I think increasing sparge water temp helps speed-up run off (less viscous), reduces chance of stuck mash and increase efficiency (a small amount)

I know many do a 2 stage batch-sparge but I'm happy doing it this way.

That's exactly what I do. Not had a problem yet.

EDIT: That is a two-stage batch sparge isn't it?

[jmc]

I nearly always batch sparge.

1) Run off wort from mash
2) Add 1/2 sparge water at 86C. This normally raises mash to ~72-74C. Set HLT temp control to 80C. Leave batch for 15mins to let sugars dissolve then run off.
3) Add other 1/2 sparge water to mash at about 80-82C. Mash temp typically now 76C. Leave 15mins then run off.

I think increasing sparge water temp helps speed-up run off (less viscous), reduces chance of stuck mash and increase efficiency (a small amount)

I know many do a 2 stage batch-sparge but I'm happy doing it this way.

That's exactly what I do. Not had a problem yet.

EDIT: That is a two-stage batch sparge isn't it?

I run off wort in 3 stages ( initial run off, sparge 1 & sparge 2).

Others dont run off mash wort on its own. 1st they add enough hot sparge water to mash so that it you get half of target wort volume in 1st run off then add rest of sparge water for 2nd run off.

[Mitchamitri1]

I quite often mash overnight - I did this weekend - I use Andys strike temp calculator off here to get the strike temp to 67% ish, Theres no way on earth the mash is near that temp the next morning, especially this time of year in the garage, so I get the sparge water to just off boiling before adding it. I have a plastic container in the tun with holes in it I just (Literally and indelicately) chuck the sparge water in, leave it for a few minutes before drawing it off. I make 45-50 litres at a time.

This all works for me - the only point at all during brewing I measure the temperature of anything is the water for strike temp.

Maybe this approach isn't scientific enough and would make most AG brewers cringe but I get great results, maybe it just becomes instinct after a while.

The only point I do have great attention to detail is sterilisation of kit.