Another 'stuck' brew

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Muscleguy
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Another 'stuck' brew

Post by Muscleguy » Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:37 pm

This ones an oatmeal stout recipe, OG 1.053 Safale F2 yeast. The yeast went woosh! it was over in less than 24hrs, head gone. It was 1.026 by then. FG should be about 1.015. I added more yeast nutrient, it woke up and is now 1.022 and absolutely quiet and dead. The harsh hops have gone, subsumed by the malt flavours. Sympson's golden promise, roasted barley, oats, a small amount of black malt, handful of wheat malt for some head and the remains of some chocolate malt for want of anything else to do with it.

Predicted OG was 1.050 so I overshot it slightly. Which means I can't be doing much wrong with mashing. I even managed to fly mash it pretty well. It is very black and oily, most promising as an oatmeal stout.

So like my Scottish Heavy which is nice with fruity notes. Should I accept this or what? my gravity meter works fine for wine. It went down to 0.994 on my Gorse flower wine before I sweetened it up.

I blamed the stuck gravity on the Heavy on the sugar. No such excuse avaiable this time, no sugar, no DME or LME just freshly ground (except for the chocolate) malts (I bought a Malt Mill).

Muscleguy
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Re: Another 'stuck' brew

Post by Muscleguy » Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:40 pm

Next one planned is a big Imperial Stout for long maturation, traditional recipe then a Harviestoun Schiehalion Clone Pilsner.

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bitter_dave
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Re: Another 'stuck' brew

Post by bitter_dave » Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:04 pm

Safale F2 sounds like it is a yeast for secondary fermentation (I just looked it up!). I'm guessing this might not help with getting the attenuation you want. I also wonder if it is still fermenting? It can continue slowly fermenting after the Krasen has gone. How long has it been fermenting?

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MashBag
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Re: Another 'stuck' brew

Post by MashBag » Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:10 am

Not all sugars produced in mashing are necessarily fermentable.
What temps did you use?

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An Ankoù
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Re: Another 'stuck' brew

Post by An Ankoù » Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:39 am

F2 is specifically a bottling yeast. It claims to carbonate your beer without affecting the character of the beer. I understand this to mean that it will ferment the priming sugar, but none of the more complex sugars. So if your mash has produced a fair amount of malto-triose, none of that will be touched. Windsor yeast would produce a similar result. Unlike Windsor, though, it adds no character to the beer.
You might try to bring the gravity of your beer down by adding another yeast like Nottingham or US-05. If you're very desperate, Champagne or cider yeast.
You should definitely choose a different yeast for future brews.
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MashBag
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Re: Another 'stuck' brew

Post by MashBag » Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:52 am

An Ankoù wrote:
Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:39 am
F2 is specifically a bottling yeast. It claims to carbonate your beer without affecting the character of the beer. I understand this to mean that it will ferment the priming sugar, but none of the more complex sugars. So if your mash has produced a fair amount of malto-triose, none of that will be touched. Windsor yeast would produce a similar result. Unlike Windsor, though, it adds no character to the beer.
You might try to bring the gravity of your beer down by adding another yeast like Nottingham or US-05. If you're very desperate, Champagne or cider yeast.
You should definitely choose a different yeast for future brews.
Good spot that man.
Just read the tech sheet.
This fermentation is not stuck. It has finished what it was selected to do.
Not the yeast for the job.
Repitch required.

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Jocky
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Re: Another 'stuck' brew

Post by Jocky » Wed Apr 21, 2021 7:03 am

An Ankoù wrote:
Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:39 am
F2 is specifically a bottling yeast. It claims to carbonate your beer without affecting the character of the beer. I understand this to mean that it will ferment the priming sugar, but none of the more complex sugars. So if your mash has produced a fair amount of malto-triose, none of that will be touched. Windsor yeast would produce a similar result. Unlike Windsor, though, it adds no character to the beer.
You might try to bring the gravity of your beer down by adding another yeast like Nottingham or US-05. If you're very desperate, Champagne or cider yeast.
You should definitely choose a different yeast for future brews.
The one thing I will add to that is that I would not add champagne yeast. According to a chap from Lallemand who has done a couple of presentations to home brewers, Champagne yeasts are generally also unable to ferment maltotriose. They also produce a kill factor protein that blocks other yeasts from reproducing.

For incomplete fermentations he recommended using Nottingham yeast and some yeast nutrient.
Last edited by Jocky on Wed Apr 21, 2021 8:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
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An Ankoù
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Re: Another 'stuck' brew

Post by An Ankoù » Wed Apr 21, 2021 7:35 am

Not sure about that, although one would think that wine yeasts have adapted to ferment the sugars found in grapes, which certainly doesn't include the maltoses. Nevertheless, my experience of Champagne yeast in commercial beers (Saveur Bière used to do some odd an interesting beers, which they've obviously had their fingers burnt with) is that, regardless of the strength, they drink a bit thin a poncy. It was the tongue-in-cheek nuclear option, though. Stick with Nottingham or US-05 or similar.
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Re: Another 'stuck' brew

Post by Muscleguy » Wed Apr 21, 2021 8:17 pm

It actually did a good fist of the first 2/3 of the ferment if rather quickly. I actually want a neutral yeast on this one since it's a first attempt at a recipe using a good stout recipe using pale ale malt and roasted barley, using the general rules of proportions for the rest and trying to get the ABV up towards if not at 5%.

Also yeast is yeast.

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MashBag
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Re: Another 'stuck' brew

Post by MashBag » Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:06 am

yeast is yeast
Nah. Absolutely cannot agree with you there.

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Re: Another 'stuck' brew

Post by Cobnut » Thu Apr 22, 2021 2:33 pm

MashBag wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:06 am
yeast is yeast
Nah. Absolutely cannot agree with you there.
Agreed.

If it were the case, why would you use brewer's yeast? You could just chuck in some dried bread yeast. I've no doubt it would ferment some of the sugars, but not sure what sort of flavours you'd get.

Doubtless someone has tried it...

Or just let the wild yeasts have a go. Surely you'd get a lovely lambic ;)
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Re: Another 'stuck' brew

Post by Kingfisher4 » Thu Apr 22, 2021 3:19 pm

MashBag wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:06 am
yeast is yeast
Nah. Absolutely cannot agree with you there.
Although I only have 70 All grain batches under my belt, I’ve used several different dried yeast varieties, from Safale, CML and Mangrove Jacks. I bottle rather than keg and have noticed dramatic differences in performance and characteristics of different yeasts. It is not just theoretical, but real life. A fascinating aspect of our hobby!

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bitter_dave
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Re: Another 'stuck' brew

Post by bitter_dave » Thu Apr 22, 2021 5:14 pm

Muscleguy wrote:
Wed Apr 21, 2021 8:17 pm
I actually want a neutral yeast on this one since it's a first attempt at a recipe using a good stout recipe using pale ale malt and roasted barley
Plenty of neutral dried yeasts out there designed for primary fermentation. As others have said, the yeast you use has a huge impact on how your beer turns out

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Re: Another 'stuck' brew

Post by WalesAles » Thu Apr 22, 2021 8:47 pm

Muscleguy wrote:
Wed Apr 21, 2021 8:17 pm
yeast is yeast.
MG,
I`ve seen that 1999 film! :D

Good fun! :D

WA

Or was that a different one? #-o

Muscleguy
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Re: Another 'stuck' brew

Post by Muscleguy » Sat Apr 24, 2021 1:49 pm

So, it is Saturday and no measured movement. I made a sacrifice of a nip bottle of my dark, strong.complex 8.5% Winter Ale with yeast rescued from a bottle of Proper Job. Poured carefully into a suitable receptacle the yeasty dregs were diluted with boiled brewing water left over from this brew. Then tipped into the bucket and stirred well in.

As I drink the contents it has already begun to bubble. Having sat in that beer since Januatry it is well dark beer adapted now. It got to 8.5% and put a decent but not excessive amount of fizz into the bottle (I had to put a champagne yeast into the barrel to get enough pressure). So it has the chops for the job.

Hopefully enough of the F2 will hang around to party on the priming dextrose when I eventually barrel this.

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