reliable secondary regulator

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paulg
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reliable secondary regulator

Post by paulg » Sun Jul 18, 2021 9:13 am

Has anybody found a reliable secondary regulator the will keep pressure at 4-6 psi without drifting upwards and also allow excess pressure to vent from the keg.
I like my beer as near as possible to cask carbonation
I currently use LPG regs which dont vent and suspect a lot of my problems with foam are due to continued fermentation in the keg after racking.
I am thinking if I can find a regulator that vents and is reliable then this problem wont occur

paulg
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Re: reliable secondary regulator

Post by paulg » Sun Jul 18, 2021 9:25 am

@PeeBee
are you still using the Shako NR200 regulators.
I used to use them but found they were leaking .when my gas was turned off the primary regulator would fall over a few hours,maybe that is normal.
When I swopped to the LPG reg the pressure holds for days.
This was with the keg disconnected so only small quatities of gas involved,I just didnt want to vent all my bottle away.

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PeeBee
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Re: reliable secondary regulator

Post by PeeBee » Sun Jul 18, 2021 11:58 am

paulg wrote:
Sun Jul 18, 2021 9:25 am
@PeeBee are you still using the Shako NR200 regulators. …
Oh yes! But I don't expect them to regulate very accurately (drift) at 4PSI, and they are many times better than the typical "Pub" secondary but have their limits. I believe the more precision you get at low pressures, the wider and more disc like the regulator becomes (to accommodate the more sensitive diaphragm). People who tell you different have either paid out a small fortune for a bit of precision engineering or haven't a clue and are talking complete and utter bol%&$*! .

Those "Novacomet" (Clesse) variable 50-150mbar (.75 - 2PSI) LPG regulators are the best I've found, but they do have "difficult to source" 20-300mbar variants, that I've got but haven't tried yet, if you must go higher (0.5 - 4PSI). Game bird and poultry breeders seem to be the target users.

I sourced these pressure relief valves if worried about an LPG regulator's designed-in lack of over-pressure venting (not good to have if using with explosive gas!): https://tameson.co.uk/measurement-contr ... _to_1_bar/. Set to 1/2BAR (7.35PSI) they should provide reasonable protection. They are the lowest cracking pressure PRVs I been able to find (that I have some confidence in).

A lot of people find the idea of foam problems at such low pressure hard to grasp! But bubbles are very fragile, and don't handle higher pressure CO2 very well. So cask-levels of carbonation can be problematic! Don't initially over carbonate without good venting procedures and expect to vent very slowly for 24-48 hours if you do over carbonate (I generally use 0.5-1g sugar priming per litre) and avoid "sparklers".

Cask-conditioned style ale out of a keg/Cornie (the "treatise"): https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwzEv5 ... V1bWc/view

paulg
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Re: reliable secondary regulator

Post by paulg » Sun Jul 18, 2021 12:24 pm

thanks PeeBee
I was probably not clear in my posting.
I have a 50-150 mbar reg for my handpump which works for that ,however I use the normal tap on my kegerator most of the time as
i dont want to waste 1/2 pint and drink 1 pint.
I have been using the 0.5-2 bar lpg regulator but one is drifting badly,Set at 5 psi next morning near 9psi.also I suspect I may be getting secondary fermentation causing over carbonation/foaming.
I know the shako regulators do release pressure as you have used them as a spunding valve so they would overcome the secondary ferment problem to an extent.I they are set at 5 psi and vent somewhere near then it shouldnt be a problem.
My concern with the shako is that with a closed gas bottle and outlet from the shako regulator the gas pressure on the guage drops overnight to nil.I realise there is very little gas contained in the pipe/reg and maybe i am overthinking it.

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PeeBee
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Re: reliable secondary regulator

Post by PeeBee » Sun Jul 18, 2021 6:58 pm

So do mine! But I don't worry too much about faultlessly maintaining pressure in a few feet of narrow bore piping - I think of my bicycle tyres (from the days when I could sit on a bike) and how long they stay inflated with a "slow puncture".

5PSI is quite a lot. Still low enough pressure to help conserve the bubbles (foam), but high enough to ensure lots of bubbles - I think that is a recipe for lots of foam.

Going from 5 to 9PSI over night sounds like inadequate venting. To get 9PSI down to 5 will take at least 24 hours of gradual venting.

Cask-conditioned style ale out of a keg/Cornie (the "treatise"): https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwzEv5 ... V1bWc/view

paulg
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Location: Corfu,Greece formely Essex/Suffolk border UK

Re: reliable secondary regulator

Post by paulg » Sun Jul 18, 2021 7:09 pm

Going from 5 to 9PSI over night sounds like inadequate venting. To get 9PSI down to 5 will take at least 24 hours of gradual venting.
This was with the sankey coupler disconnected so not venting problem.The other lpg reg has held steady with exactly the same conditions.
I do think the maybe there is also some secondary fermentation taking place that cant escape due to the non return valve in the coupler that is also a factor in the foaming issue but its the creeping pressure i would like to address first and then i can remove the non return duck bill and it should vent out if I use a Shako or other venting regulator

5PSI is quite a lot. Still low enough pressure to help conserve the bubbles (foam), but high enough to ensure lots of bubbles - I think that is a recipe for lots of foam.
What would you do if you wanted to dispense from a normal tap with lowish carbonation?

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