Cornelius keg for real ale

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brewzone2021
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Cornelius keg for real ale

Post by brewzone2021 » Fri Jan 15, 2021 9:36 pm

I have just bought a corni keg, stainless tap, 3/16th beer line, various fittings inc ball locks etc.

I have used bottles of co2 from a pub landlord a few years back.

Sadly He passed away almost 6 years to the day after Dad Who was a long standing pub regular.

So no pub gas and the gauges I had have been lost to time.

So got to thinking, how to keep real Ale using a keg.

I only drink a couple of pints a night so a keg will last around 3 weeks.

I want to keep a layer of co2 above the beer but not much above atmospheric pressure and so decided on this setup.

2 liter bottles of sparkling water for the co2.

One of those stainless ball lock pet bottle carbonation caps.

I will use it in the reverse of how its designed to operate.

Connect it to the short in tube of the corni, the grey one I think?

Use a staiinless valve to control the co2 going into the keg and allow it to be shut off.

Connect the Black ball lock to the 3/16 tubing and then through a cooling coil in a 33L pot full of water and a block of ice to the stainless tap with more 3/16th tubing.

I plan to shake the half empty bottle of sparkling water to create just enough co2 to replace what pours into the glass.

The keg will be primed with however much priming sugar I need to get the real Ale condition.

Ill let You know how it goes in a month when its all ready.

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LeeH
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Re: Cornelius keg for real ale

Post by LeeH » Sat Jan 16, 2021 2:36 pm

...awaiting a 10 page reply from pee bee.
Sabro Single Hop NEIPA 25/02/20 CLICK ME to monitor progress with Brewfather & iSpindel

brewzone2021
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Re: Cornelius keg for real ale

Post by brewzone2021 » Sun Jan 17, 2021 11:34 am

?

Feels like a scene from the day the earth stood still....

When's Gort due ?

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PeeBee
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Re: Cornelius keg for real ale

Post by PeeBee » Sun Jan 17, 2021 8:08 pm

LeeH wrote:
Sat Jan 16, 2021 2:36 pm
...awaiting a 10 page reply from pee bee.
Ger-off! Anyway, not for me, I cheat and use a CO2 cylinder. But I've been woken now so I'll chuck the "treatise" at it: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwzEv5 ... V1bWc/view
Cask-conditioned style ale out of a keg/Cornie (the "treatise"): https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwzEv5 ... rDKRMjcO1g
Water report demystified (the "Defuddler"; removes the nonsense!): https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/ ... sp=sharing

brewzone2021
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Re: Cornelius keg for real ale

Post by brewzone2021 » Sun Jan 17, 2021 8:37 pm

Cheers PeeBee can't say I've seen that particular writeup.

I did use various maxi cooler type setups with the tubing balanced between 0-1 psi and those Italian style flow controlled taps.

I'm eager to see how it goes when the next brew is off primary.

Carnot
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Re: Cornelius keg for real ale

Post by Carnot » Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:03 pm

I think that you will find some useful charts on carbonation at the top of the post for dispensing from Jim which gives some details on the concentration of carbon dioxide in g/L.

You will not only need to replace the volume of liquid drawn off with carbon dioxide but also provide a driving force to push out the beer. As you wish to use a coloer and a delivery line this will need several psi of pressure and the flow will be affected by the beer head above / below the pouring point.

A 2 ltr bottle of carbonated water will contain relatively small volumes of carbon dioxide - maybe 7g at best. You can get an indication from the carbonation charts. The corny has a volume of about 19 ltrs which is about 0.85 moles or 37+/-g of carbon dioxide, or about 3 soda syphon cartridges.

Another option would be a soda stream cylinder and a regulator which can be had for about £25 off eBay. I use this approach and as well Adams carbon dioxide (welding gas). The carbon dioxide going into welding bottles or pub gas all comes out of the same tank. The carbon dioxide is produced from breweries and fertiliser plants, the latter produce ammonia via the Haber Bosch process which produces carbon dioxide as a co-product.

brewzone2021
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Re: Cornelius keg for real ale

Post by brewzone2021 » Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:27 pm

Bought a diy co2 aquarium kit which will fit My requirements perfectly.

Seems Hogarth had similar ideas 10 years back

viewtopic.php?t=33960

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Re: Cornelius keg for real ale

Post by brewzone2021 » Sat Jan 30, 2021 9:47 pm

Tested with a full corny of water and this CO2 aquarium system got up to 1.8 bar 26 psi pretty quickly and has dispensed 11 pints using half the citric acid in the bottle labeled A.

Cost £15 for 2kg each of citric acid and Sodium bicarbonate.

So looks like once the corny is filled with beer and primed using sugar to whatever volume of CO2 for the style its going to cost £2.8 to dispense 33 pints at serving pressure.

I don't need pub gas or soda stream refills :-)

BZ
Last edited by brewzone2021 on Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

brewzone2021
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Re: Cornelius keg for real ale

Post by brewzone2021 » Sat Jan 30, 2021 9:53 pm

Just need a cooler box for the chiller coil and beer tap.

Happy days.

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Re: Cornelius keg for real ale

Post by brewzone2021 » Sun Jan 31, 2021 4:51 pm

Very happy with the water test over last 24 hrs.
Carbonated well and dispensed 33 1/2 pints and still plenty of spare citric acid left in bottle A and enough bicarb in bottle B to convince Me this is the answer to My dispense requirements for either Keg ale or real ale with a blanket of CO2 to keep dispensing over a 3 week period.
Its also fun watching the reaction between the citric and bicarb every time a pint is poured.
For anyone having issues getting pub gas or fed up of swapping soda stream bottles I highly recommend a search on EBay for DIY CO2 kits for aquariums.
Not much modification needed for the home brewer.
Been a while since I've been able to tinker around with brewing stuff so dead chuffed.

f00b4r
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Re: Cornelius keg for real ale

Post by f00b4r » Sun Jan 31, 2021 6:09 pm

Interesting approach, I wonder if you give into a 2-6kg gas bottle after using the system for a while. Let us know though!

brewzone2021
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Re: Cornelius keg for real ale

Post by brewzone2021 » Sun Jan 31, 2021 7:45 pm

f00b4r wrote:
Sun Jan 31, 2021 6:09 pm
Interesting approach, I wonder if you give into a 2-6kg gas bottle after using the system for a while. Let us know though!
I'm probably going to stick with this as it amuses Me each time a glug of citric hisses away as it mixes with the bicarb.

Plus I got quoted £75 quid locally for a bottle inc deposit and the first fill not including gauges.

Funds are tight atm so this is cheap as chips.

The leftover fluid is citric carbonate which I'm sure I can find a use for, its supposed to dissolve kidney stones ?

brewzone2021
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Re: Cornelius keg for real ale

Post by brewzone2021 » Sun Jan 31, 2021 7:47 pm

I used the remaining CO2 to emulate a starsan and line cleaner flush so all in all a success.

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Re: Cornelius keg for real ale

Post by brewzone2021 » Sun Jan 31, 2021 8:33 pm

One thought occurred to Me....

If there is a CO2 leak I won't feel like ripping out My hair as I just need to make up a refill which is a ten minute job at most. No empty cylinder and a trip to the supplier next day etc.

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Re: Cornelius keg for real ale

Post by hebbstar » Mon Nov 08, 2021 7:06 pm

Hi Brewzone

How are you getting on with this kit?

Looks really interesting especially given that the price of CO2 may be even more expensive.

I'm also looking at hydroponic growing of chilli's next year and to give them more CO2 may increase the yield.

Cheers

Paul

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