Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Discuss making up beer kits - the simplest way to brew.
Post Reply
BeerJammer

Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Post by BeerJammer » Fri Apr 01, 2011 11:19 am

Hi All.

Being the type of chap to try new things, bu**er the consequences and risk the wraith of the seasoned brewers (my mulled stout went quite well at xmas :lol: ), I find myself pondering a bit of an experiment. :idea:
I ordered a Coopers Old Dark Ale kit online a month or two back and got send a Caxtons Ale kit by error. The vendor didnt want it back as it was cheaper for him to let me keep it. Good Chap. :D Now, as this is a freebie and my own logic says if I kipper it then I havent lost anyting I was toying with making a super strong ale, with the intention being just to let people taste it and go, "Jeez! Only a madman would create such a tipple?". Definitely not a session beer, more of an exhibition item. :twisted:
Here's what I plan.
  • Make the kit up to 10L not 20L
    Use some 48hr Turbo yeast I have left over that makes up 20% base alcohol spirit for my Southern Comfort clones
    Use the same level of fermentables per litre as I use for the above
    Ferment as normal, bottle as normal.
As I said, I dont mind if this works or not, I am not a great fan of Caxtons. I dont expect the full 20%, but probably the high teens. Why am I trying it? Because I can 8)

Anyone interested in tracking my progress?

Stomach
Under the Table
Posts: 1408
Joined: Sat Aug 07, 2010 10:18 pm
Location: Aberystwyth

Re: Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Post by Stomach » Fri Apr 01, 2011 12:09 pm

Sounds like a very intresting experiment!! I would love to hear how it goes!!! :D

Fermenting:-
FV 1 - Festival Spiced Winter Ale
FV 2 - Empty
FV 3 - Empty
FV 4 - Ditches Stout

Drinking:-
Keg 1 - Nothing

Conditioning:-

Bottles - Brewferm Winter Ale
Bottles - Brewferm Triple

Next
Work in progress
Old Tin of Coopers Cerveza
Couple of old tins of stuff to experiment with!

Spud395

Re: Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Post by Spud395 » Fri Apr 01, 2011 12:55 pm

What other fermentables are you going to add? a 2 can kit brewed to 10L should only work out about 9% at best.
Isnt the product of that turbo yeast suposed to be filtered through charcoal (only read this I never used it)
to remove the manky flavours it produces?
If you just want to try the kit to 10L a good ale yeast will give you the 9% or there abouts that to be go from the tins and you would have beer, just a thought

jimp2003

Re: Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Post by jimp2003 » Fri Apr 01, 2011 2:53 pm

Definitely keep us posted on your progress BeerJammer. I love reading about these off-the-wall experiments.

Who knows - you might discover the homebrewing equivalent of quantum physics! :wacko:

JammyBStard

Re: Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Post by JammyBStard » Fri Apr 01, 2011 3:48 pm

Turbo yeast; thats bio-fuel stuff isn't it :)
I've heard of it been used in home Distilling but not Beer making with any sucess, I suspect it would mullar it. If it could be done I'm sure Brewdog would be doing it!

I've brewed up to 10% sucessfully with US05 by slowly feeding it DME and sugar over a couple of weeks, slowly increasing the temp a little and rousing the yeast as often as possible (very important). you could probably go on to 16% or 17% with a re-pitch of champagne yeast without manking it up.

You can of-course do whatever you want! Please let us know how it goes though.

BeerJammer

Re: Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Post by BeerJammer » Sat Apr 02, 2011 12:53 pm

Spud395 wrote:What other fermentables are you going to add? a 2 can kit brewed to 10L should only work out about 9% at best.
Isnt the product of that turbo yeast suposed to be filtered through charcoal (only read this I never used it)
to remove the manky flavours it produces?
If you just want to try the kit to 10L a good ale yeast will give you the 9% or there abouts that to be go from the tins and you would have beer, just a thought
Normal fermentables, The turbo yeast needs 4 Kg of sugar per 5L, so thats a hell of a lot of sugar I grant you, but it is an experiment :twisted:

yes, the turbo yeast uses a charcoal as a fining system. I will have a taste after primary fermantation and see if it needs it.

User avatar
gti1x
Piss Artist
Posts: 133
Joined: Tue Mar 02, 2010 6:20 pm
Location: Garelochhead, Scotland

Re: Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Post by gti1x » Sat Apr 02, 2011 5:38 pm

Yes, but if you use charcoal it removes all flavours (and colours) - including the "beer" ones!! What you'll be left with is just the same as though you had used just sugar. Personally I wouldn't bother with the turbo yeast, but use some high alcohol tolerant yeast, such as champagne yeast, as suggested by JammyBStard, above. On the other hand, it isn't my experiment!!

GTI
Drinking: Kriek (cherry beer); prohibition coconut rum; Davey's Best Bitter 2 (AG); TC; Mead; Gorse Wine; Darwin's summer ale; Apple wine
Conditioning: Grape wine 2009 & 2010; Pomegranate and cherry wine
Brewing: Vinojay (orange wine); Vino de tavola - rosso
Planning: Newton's Porter
Gone but not forgotten: Mead; Framboos (Kit); Gorse wine;

JammyBStard

Re: Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Post by JammyBStard » Sun Apr 03, 2011 2:19 pm

If it was my experiment and I was going with champagne yeast I would make the kit as normal, halving the vol would double the unfermentables left behind and it might come out too sweet (unless the kit is very pale) and then at the same time I would make a starter with sugar of champagne yeast. When the primary kit brew has finished I would move it onto a secondary FV on to the sugar (actually seen as it's a kit and there's no break material, I'd probably chuck the sugar into the primary and then add the Champ' yeast from the starter. The reason I'd starter the champ yeast on sugar is so it's tolerant to alcohol before it gets chucked into a secondary full of it and it's been munching dextrose not maltose so it should hopefully leave the maltose alone and not dry the beer out too much.

Just a thought!

BeerJammer

Re: Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Post by BeerJammer » Fri Apr 15, 2011 3:50 pm

Hi All.

Jsut a quick note, I am going to give this a whirl this weekend. The weather looks wet, so I'll get the experiment started instead. :twisted:

BeerJammer

Re: Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Post by BeerJammer » Sat Apr 16, 2011 4:22 pm

Tis done.

The Ale is in the FV. :-)

For info, the OG for this brew, (need to think of a name), is 1.110

BeerJammer

Re: Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Post by BeerJammer » Sun Apr 17, 2011 3:20 pm

Brewing nicely in the FV after 24hrs, got a foam top about 8cm! So its fermenting and something alcoholic will come out of it. lol

User avatar
gti1x
Piss Artist
Posts: 133
Joined: Tue Mar 02, 2010 6:20 pm
Location: Garelochhead, Scotland

Re: Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Post by gti1x » Mon Apr 18, 2011 1:35 pm

Interested in how this turns out.

What yeast did you use in the end?

GTI
Drinking: Kriek (cherry beer); prohibition coconut rum; Davey's Best Bitter 2 (AG); TC; Mead; Gorse Wine; Darwin's summer ale; Apple wine
Conditioning: Grape wine 2009 & 2010; Pomegranate and cherry wine
Brewing: Vinojay (orange wine); Vino de tavola - rosso
Planning: Newton's Porter
Gone but not forgotten: Mead; Framboos (Kit); Gorse wine;

stapes

Re: Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Post by stapes » Tue Apr 26, 2011 4:45 pm

Any new on this yet? Would like to know how you are getting on?

Stomach
Under the Table
Posts: 1408
Joined: Sat Aug 07, 2010 10:18 pm
Location: Aberystwyth

Re: Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Post by Stomach » Thu Apr 28, 2011 11:16 am

stapes wrote:Any new on this yet? Would like to know how you are getting on?
Its all gone quiet!! Maybe he is still in rehab after his stomach was pumped, when he stoppped fighting with the 20 riot police, after he smashed his house up!!! :mrgreen:

Fermenting:-
FV 1 - Festival Spiced Winter Ale
FV 2 - Empty
FV 3 - Empty
FV 4 - Ditches Stout

Drinking:-
Keg 1 - Nothing

Conditioning:-

Bottles - Brewferm Winter Ale
Bottles - Brewferm Triple

Next
Work in progress
Old Tin of Coopers Cerveza
Couple of old tins of stuff to experiment with!

BeerJammer

Re: Okeydokey - Experiment time!

Post by BeerJammer » Mon May 09, 2011 3:55 pm

Hi All

Sorry for the long delay... had a mental time with some idiot in a Jag wrecking the back quarter of my car. :( and some bank holidays away.
Nothing as exciting as 'Stomach' imagines. lol

So how is the brew?
I left if a good 10 days to ferment, the yeast I used (alcotec turbo 48), did just like it does with my vodka base, it went mental in the first two days and then the activity died away. It was still slowly fermenting and the yeast instructions do state: (in regards to the method for making the vodka base)
"After two days the yeast will have fermented the brew to aproximately 17% ABV. Fermentation can, if chosen, continue for a further 5 days to acheive approx 20% ABV"
I left it a bit longer as I was away over the bank holidays. :lol:

On the last bank holiday I bottled it, (5x 2L PET) with a small ammount of sugar to allow bottle conditioning, left in the warm spare room for a week. I always squeeze in the PET when I seal them so I have a visual aid to how the SV is progressing. They took a while to pop out and even then they arent as pressurized as a normal beer. I guessed this may be because I used a bit to much sugar when mixing so I think this yeast cant do much more converting, and also there are the 'unknown variables' of using this yeast with something it wasnt ment for.

When I moved it to the cold store, (under my stairs with Harry Potter), I couldn't resist testing it... that was Saturday morning. When I awoke in Casualty with a tube down my throat... :? Nah.. just kidding :lol: . I tried a half pint and here is the result.

1: It is very strong. The OG and FV numbers work out to about 17%. You can taste the strength too, that definite alcohol tingle you get with any drink higher than a normal wine.
2: Its sweet. This backs up my theory that the yeast has stopped working efficiently. I realised after fermenting that I messed up my calculations and forgot to factor in any fermentables already in the ale kit in my working out. I followed the yeast instructions sugar quantity which is added to just water. #-o
3: The yeast has given the ale a rather unique twang. I cant say its unpleasant, but it is there. The brew isn't as clear as a normal brew at the time I drank it, so this taste is prob from some yeast still in suspension. After a month or two resting the yeast should drop nicely and mature a bit too.
4: If I value my kidneys and my sanity, I will not drink any more than a pint at a time.
5: Given time to condition, I dont see why this ale will not be a bit of a stonker. I know that any of my brews I drink a week after bottling/kegging are never at their best so the same will be true here.
6: As my OP stated, this is an experiment to see 'What if?', that said its far from a failed one. Its drinkable, tasty (any suggestions to lower sweetness would be appreciated :) ) and stands as a good demonstrator to mates and family that yes, I can brew a beer and yes I can brew something to blow your socks off.

Will I brew it again? YES! but with some changes...
1: reduce the amount of sugar when preparing or lengthen the brew.
2: do some research on any forums with a discussion on this type of yeast to pick up any tips to make it drop clearer or improve its fermentation.
3: Be more selective with the Kit. I used this one as it was a freebie, but this type of ale may not be the best for a head shrinker. Maybe a porter or stout?

Feel free to ask any questions.
If there is anyone local in Somerset who want to try it, please PM me.

Post Reply