Saison Mumbler

[lancsSteve]

Wyeast 3711 is apparently much easier to handle than the Dupont strain - I've used 3711, and it went to dryness (1.002!) without any silly temperatures or long fermentation times.

I've used recultured DuPont and it's AMAZING strain - from what I can infer DuPont use a major mixed strain (4 - 6 strains) in house. However WhiteLabs became the dept of improvements and picked the 'dominant strain' for WLP565 which seems to crap out after a while. I can't help but think this is why DuPont maintain a mixed house strain - to stop that.

4 beers made from DuPont recultures have dealt well with high temps and done fine at lower, fermented out fully to 1.002 and generally an incredble characerful yeast.

Have used the Fantome strain (Wyeast 3725) too but that hit the buffers and stopped around 1.014 so used champagne yeast to finish up - fantastic phenols but seems as picky as wlp565. Wonder if Fantome wild strains take up the slack later...?

I have a magnum of "Saison DuPont Cuvee dry hopping 2011" bought from brewery to crack sometime soon and reculture from the slurry in that - should be good!

My top Belgian yeasts so far are def DuPont reculture and the Bastogne (Orval) yeast - loved the La Rulles yeast and recultured a lot from a bottle of Estival so that's next one to use.

[coatesg]

I think that's possibly why so many have issues with 3724 (I think...) - it does just stop of it's own accord unless you run it at blood temps...it'd be interesting to find out what temperatures Dupont actually use. The 3711 (from Thiriez - "French Saison") works at ~22C very happily - perhaps a mixed pitch (or pitching 3724 first followed by an active pitch of 3711 to finish off) would work very nicely

[leedsbrew]

I dislike the term "farmhouse" in the saison description, as immediately people think lacto/brett/farmyard... but I think there's is some room for manoeuver in the ingredients.

It's those flavours and aromas I love about that style!

[testtube]

I missed Lancssteve got a cracking result in that compo..

Lancssteve..

Nice one...

TheMumbler..

Has he got all smug now? Doesn't go to the pub as the beer is inferior to his educated palate.. that led him to brew a superior beer, that he may let you drink if you dig his mash tun and polish glasses.. for his superior beer? And then when you do get a taste, he spend's the next.. hour's.. with why his beer is superior and to which rule book he has adheared to, to the point it make's you cry??

I'm going to have a go, I recon if I go easy on the malt, should be ok, but in my usual fashion it will have a lot of aroma hop's in..

Farmhouse to me is being a farm hand sat there on a big table eating a large plate of food and swilling it down with a beer.. With arga's and the smell of well..farm's...

[TheMumbler]

TheMumbler..

Has he got all smug now? (snip)

I haven't actually seen Steve since he got back. Possibly I missed the triumphal march through town! I presume this is down to us both being busy, but I guess that I might no longer be considered worthy

I kid. He is, of course, gracious in defeat and magnanimous in victory.

Why not have a go at a Saison? If it isn't ready in time for the NCBA meet you'll just have to drink it later.

[mr.c]

Didn't enter the beer I brewed using the DuPont yeast I got form Steve , just found 20 bottles of it in the back of the cupboard (11 months old) cant remember if I used it at bottling time or not ,will have to go of the notes .....

[Barley Water]

Humm, sounds like you guys have a "mutual admiration society" going on over there. I've got a Saison going right now, it's still in primary (mainly because I haven't gotten around to racking it yet). I used the Dupont strain again although I have heard good things about the mixed strains, good flavors and much less a pain in the butt to handle. My attitude about the style is that since it was made by farmers, rustic is the traditional way to go. I agree, it needs to be dry as hell and the last one I made just is not dry enough. Once the main strain is done doing it's thing, I'm going to pitch in some Brett B, you know those farmers had lousey sanitation back in the day. I would be willing to bet that they got lousey attenuation until the wild yeasts took over so I figure that should be authentic. Also, I think they threw into the grist what they had so a mixture of malted and unmalted grains should be ok plus variety is good also. Unmalted grains will tend to add starches to the wort and if you start messing with the bugs, they will just love the starch. As far as sugar goes, you know those guys were using some pretty crude stuff so I personally like to use the less refined sugars plus it will add some unique taste.

By the way, I know this thread is old but I don't know that I would use WLP550 for this style and especially if you are thinking about fermenting warm. The thing about the Dupont strain that is very unusual is that you can ferment very warm and not throw off a bunch of fusels. Fruity is one thing but hot, medicianal flavors will wreak your beer every single time, and give you a great big headache (try judging some mead at a contest some time and you will know exactly what I am talking about).

[testtube]

I would be willing to bet that they got lousey attenuation until the wild yeasts took over so I figure that should be authentic

You probably right, if you get a wild yeast infection one way of telling is if it ferment's down to a low gravity...

[testtube]

Humm, sounds like you guys have a "mutual admiration society" going on over there.

No... I hate them, I'm a Yorkshire man, I hate everybody over the Pennines, south of the wash, pretty much anybody that's not from Yorkshire really..

I like Texas though, on account of the golf course's and it's the only place in the world you can wear a cowboy hat and not be taken to be a big raving homo..

TheMumbler's not too bad, he has a beard, so I know he can't tell a bare faced lie..

[lancsSteve]

I missed Lancssteve got a cracking result in that compo..

Lancssteve..

Nice one...

TheMumbler..

Has he got all smug now? Doesn't go to the pub as the beer is inferior to his educated palate..

Well no smugger than before! My Orval-inspired-thing did really well (45 from one judge and given "ouutstanding / flawless / classic"!!! But got 42.5 overall as other judge was slightly less enamoured). Other beers did between OK and good but nowt else outstanding. Still think Bosium's noble pils lager was way better than my (distant) 2nd placed one.
That said Rich C did WAY better than me on the Saison's (41 points to my 29 a piece) so he should talk about making them not me!

Humm, sounds like you guys have a "mutual admiration society" going on over there.

Well - err... TheMumbler lives round the corner and once threw me into a pond on my stag (I got him with a mean uppercut on my way back up) and Mr C's my bro-in-law and gave me my firstbrewing setup... part of which the mumbler then trashed - so it's more an old-boys network than a mutual appreciation society.

By the way, I know this thread is old but I don't know that I would use WLP550 for this style and especially if you are thinking about fermenting warm. The thing about the Dupont strain that is very unusual is that you can ferment very warm and not throw off a bunch of fusels.

550 seems a good 'all round strain' but nothing beats DuPont! Can't wait to try the DuPont bottles you've found there Mr C!!! Bring some up for the NCBA event in October will you?

[testtube]

Well - err... TheMumbler lives round the corner and once threw me into a pond on my stag (I got him with a mean uppercut on my way back up) and Mr C's my bro-in-law and gave me my firstbrewing setup... part of which the mumbler then trashed..

Just love that..

As far as guessing where the orval bit came from I reconed that would be cheating..

[TheMumbler]

You know, I was the only stag decent enough to try and help him out of that pond. What do I get for thanks? Dragged into the water and punched in the face. To be fair I think he caught me in the chin with wildly flailing arms rather than trying to floor (pond?) me Rocky style. Yes I should have seen the being dragged into the pond coming but my judgement was a tad impaired by that point, still it was a good do

As Steve says he and I know each other in "real life" and it was him (via mrc) that got me into brewing when he upgraded the first set of kit he inherited from mrc. So really all those prizes belong to mrc for his generosity in hand me downs. The mishap in question is documented here. Stu mentioned in that thread is still brewing AG so I must have done something right.

[testtube]

To be fair I think he caught me in the chin with wildly flailing arms rather than trying to floor (pond?) me Rocky style.

Not what e sez!

[lancsSteve]

As Steve says he and I know each other in "real life" and it was him (via mrc) that got me into brewing when he upgraded the first set of kit he inherited from mrc. So really all those prizes belong to mrc for his generosity in hand me downs. The mishap in question is documented here. Stu mentioned in that thread is still brewing AG so I must have done something right.

That bloody bucket - was disaster prone even before it got melted out: viewtopic.php?f=24&t=26600

[testtube]

Steve, is this or is this not themumbler.. In 'real life' ...



Noble warrior...