Dried fruit aroma and flavour

[Fr_Marc]

During the winter months I really enjoy a dried fruit/plum/fruitcake aroma and flavour in darkish beers. Do you have any suggestions on how to best archieve this? What malts or adjuncts do you suggest? Which mash profile etc?

Thank you for your input!

Marc

PS: I do not want to put dried fruit, plums, fruitcake or spices into the kettle or fermenter. Thank you!

[MashBag]

PS: I do not want to put dried fruit, plums, fruitcake or spices into the kettle or fermenter. Thank you!

Can I ask why?

[Fr_Marc]

I fear it is a German thing, mashbag. I am by no means a Reinheitsgebot extremist (using brewing sugar et al), but something inside of me strongly resists putting fruit and stuff into beer.

Also, I know that it can be done with just malt, hops, water, yeast and maybe sugar. I just don‘t happen to know how.

Cheers! Marc

[The_Antikveik]

Dark crystal malt helps quite a bit.

[f00b4r]

Special B or W. Simpson’s newish DRC is meant to be similar and I’ve just tried some in a porter but it’s currently finishing fermenting so maybe someone else can comment on it in the finished beer.

[Eric]

Choice of grains and hops will certainly impact flavours and aromas in the outcome, but choice of yeast is also important as can be seen by the profiles from a typical Burton Yeast and one particular from Scotland. Avoid so called neutral yeasts like

Burton.jpg (62.29 KiB) Viewed 2391 times

Scottish.jpg (63.49 KiB) Viewed 2391 times

Avoid so called neutral yeast like SO5 and several others that rip out malt to enable aggressive hops to dominate.

Similarly, it is helpful not to have too much sulphate in the brewing liquor which will dry the beer and accentuate bitterness, instead have a chloride biased profile. Use a water profile with over 100 ppm calcium, which is not always essential in darker beers, to enhance good flocclation of break and yeast and reduce any muddy flavours from those. Adding a decent dose of calcium chloride flake to the boil can sometimes make a substantial difference.

[MashBag]

I fear it is a German thing, mashbag. I am by no means a Reinheitsgebot extremist (using brewing sugar et al), but something inside of me strongly resists putting fruit and stuff into beer.

Also, I know that it can be done with just malt, hops, water, yeast and maybe sugar. I just don‘t happen to know how.

Cheers! Marc

Could you steep ingredients in warm water, get the taste profile of what you want, and then add it?

Just for the record, I am not a fan of fruit in beer either.

[Fr_Marc]

Simpson’s newish DRC is meant to be similar and I’ve just tried some in a porter but it’s currently finishing fermenting so maybe someone else can comment on it in the finished beer.

I have read very mixed comments on DRC and would be interested in your thoughts once your beer is finished.

[Fr_Marc]

Choice of grains and hops will certainly impact flavours and aromas in the outcome, but choice of yeast is also important as can be seen by the profiles from a typical Burton Yeast and one particular from Scotland. [...]
Adding a decent dose of calcium chloride flake to the boil can sometimes make a substantial difference.

Thank you for your input, Eric. I will take your suggestions to heart. Is there any yeast strain that you would recommend for what I am up to? The profile of the Scottish strain you posted looks promising.

Cheers! Marc

[Fr_Marc]

Could you steep ingredients in warm water, get the taste profile of what you want, and then add it?
Just for the record, I am not a fan of fruit in beer either.

Theoretically, I COULD do that. But that's really not the road I want to go...not yet, at least.

[Jocky]

Modest use of DRC and a range of medium and dark crystal malts is the way to get the fruitcake flavours in a beer.

[The_Antikveik]

Do note that barley seeds - cereal seeds generally - all seeds, in fact - are actually fruits, botanically speaking. Nor would I read too much into Germany's so-called purity laws. Most traditionally brewed beer in Europe has been made with water, malted barley, hops and yeast for centuries. I think the general consensus among respected beer historians these days is that the Reinheitsgebot is more about protectionism and projecting a PR campaign that aims to distinguish German beer from others in Europe. I'm sure the quality beers brewed in Germany today have a lot more to do with healthy competition among many small-scale traditional breweries than 16th century tax scams. But I digress. Although I have a preference for traditionally brewed English ales, I do plan to toss half a dozen homemade mince pies (packed with dry fruits, mixed peel, ground almonds, spices, suet, Demerara sugar with a splash of rum and sherry) into the boil at 10 minutes, to produce a curious dark Christmas Mild this year. The mince pies are going to be steeped in the cooled wort overnight, before pitching the freshly harvested yeast. If I don't detect enough 'fruitcake' I'll consider 'dry hopping' a few more pies.

[Fr_Marc]

As I said above, I am not a Reinheitsgebot extremist. I just don‘t want to make „flavoured“ beer but flavourful beer, if that makes any sense.

[Fr_Marc]

Modest use of DRC and a range of medium and dark crystal malts is the way to get the fruitcake flavours in a beer.

Any suggestions of a tried and tested recipe, Jocky?

[Jocky]

Here’s one from Crisp - haven’t brewed it myself, but their recipes generally seem to be bang on: https://crispmalt.com/recipes/ruby/

I also made a fruity porter with:
78% Maris Otter
11% Brown
9% Crystal 240 EBC
2% Chocolate

OG was 1.053, FG 1.017
Mash at 68 C
I fermented with yeast brown from bottles of Fullers 1845, but you could use Imperial A09 Pub or your preferred English style dry yeast (a co pitch of Windsor and Nottingham would be good).