no rinse sanitiser for high ph water

paulg · Post by **paulg** » Sat Mar 17, 2012 9:27 am

my water is high ph evan the bottled water is 7.6ph is there a no rinse product I can use as I believe starsan wont work with high ph water
thanks paul

Beer O'Clock · Post by **Beer O'Clock** » Sat Mar 17, 2012 10:27 am

You could use de-ionised water. 5 litres from Halfords (Â£3.99).

oz11 · Post by **oz11** » Sat Mar 17, 2012 2:44 pm

Got an aqaurium supplies shop near? My nearest one sells RO water at (I think) 15p/Litre.

barney · Post by **barney** » Sat Mar 17, 2012 3:09 pm

My water is PH 7.8 and starsan works fine with the tap water, and stay relatively clear. My water is very soft however with low mineral content. I have checked the PH as starsan begins to go cloudy and the PH is still 3.2

paulg · Post by **paulg** » Sat Mar 17, 2012 9:09 pm

thanks for that I will look for deionised water halfords would be a bit of a trip for me as I am in greece

Skittlebrau · Post by **Skittlebrau** » Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:54 am

You can use de-ionised, distilled or RO water.

BeerEagle · Post by **BeerEagle** » Sun Mar 18, 2012 3:47 pm

paulg wrote:thanks for that I will look for deionised water halfords would be a bit of a trip for me as I am in greece

I found 5litres for 1Euro40 in Auchun in Boulogne and I know that it's stocked in Carrefour as well. Do you have any similar/related supermarkets where you are?

jmc · Post by **jmc** » Sun Mar 18, 2012 10:38 pm

I use Ashbeck still water from Tesco. About Â£1 for 5L.
You also get a free 5L fv

Kev888 · Post by **Kev888** » Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:32 pm

Buying in suitable water is the best answer for me too - there are alternatives but Starsan has some nice properties in addition to being no-rinse that make it worth the effort in my view. Like the teeny amounts needed, the foaming/clinging, short contact times and it remaining potent for quite a long time even once mixed.

You could also look into peracetic acid, which I believe can use normal water (please someone correct me if not) but thats more costly and I believe even more dangerous when neat, and it doesn't keep 'at all' well once mixed - It is supposed to be very effective though so I tend to use it just for small critical jobs rather than large volumes for cornies and so on; so its an addition rather than a replacement for starsan in my case.

I'm not certain, but I 'think' idophor (or io star and other iodine based sanitisers) may be less fussy about PH too - I don't use that myself (I don't think it keeps as well when mixed, and I tend to like having a spray bottle permanently on hand) so I can't say for sure, though.

Cheers
Kev

Post by **Aleman** » Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:44 pm

Like water treatment for mashing the pH of the water used is not at all important, what is critical is the alkalinity! Starsan is acidified so in a suitable water when mixed the pH should fall into the ~<pH3.0 range, where the active ingredient is most effective (and coincidentally the solution is clear) The problems with a water with a high alkalinity (HCO3- ions) is that it neutralises the acid in starsan so the PH of the starsan solution is higher that the required pH3.0

If you are going to use a bottles water from the supermarket ensure that it is a low alkalinity water (Low HCO3-/bicarbonate ideally < 50mg/l) such as Tescos Ashbeck or Asda Smartprice . . . Aquapura Cumbrian from Morrisons is a good choice.

Iodophors are also pH sensitive and again you need the pH of the working solution to be at pH 3.0 or slightly below, with iodophors this is easy to achieve using phosphoric acid to acidify the water before mixing. . . . However be aware that some iodophors already have sufficient acid to achieve this anyway (BTF iodophor, Fam30, and Brupaks . . .Videne does NOT!!!)

Kev888 · Post by **Kev888** » Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:49 pm

Aleman wrote:some iodophors already have sufficient acid to achieve this anyway (BTF iodophor, Fam30, and Brupaks . . .Videne does NOT!!!)

Ah, that must be why I've not seen them mention it - thanks very much for the clarification.

Cheers
Kev

paulg · Post by **paulg** » Mon Mar 19, 2012 2:29 pm

I have looked at the bottled water and it all is high ph 7 plus and about 226 HCO3 so I think it is deionised water or similer for me
beer eagle
thanks for the info about carrefore in france as it happens we have marinopoulos supermarkets here which are part of/owned by carrefore so I will check them out
paul

paulg · Post by **paulg** » Tue Mar 20, 2012 1:50 pm

found deionised water(says suitable for steamiron,batteries,car radiators) in local supermarket just over 1 euro /5 litres so sorted now just need starsan from uk with my next order.

BeerEagle · Post by **BeerEagle** » Tue Mar 20, 2012 7:18 pm

Nice one Paulg.

BluePanda · Post by **BluePanda** » Sun Jan 11, 2015 10:47 pm

Aleman wrote:
If you are going to use a bottles water from the supermarket ensure that it is a low alkalinity water (Low HCO3-/bicarbonate ideally < 50mg/l) such as Tescos Ashbeck or Asda Smartprice . . . Aquapura Cumbrian from Morrisons is a good choice.

Any idea if the Asda / Morrisons alternatives are still a viable alternative for Tesco's Ashbeck ?

I'm looking to reduce time on bottling day by using Starsan and I don't think my tap supply is the most suitable. I don't/won't shop at Tesco - hence looking for easily available alternatives.

Thank you.

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