Turn a 50L sankey keg into a HLT

[Mther]

Hi guys,

I recently bought two 50L kegs (attached image) which I will eventually turn into a HLT and mash tun. I will discuss about the HLT in this topic which seems to be the less complicated

These are Das plus kegs (German brand) with pu (polyurethane) coating, cfc free.

First question is if I can remove the coating in order to be able to heat it up with a gas hob as I find it more complicated (dangerous, less reliable) to install an electric element.

Next question(s) is if anyone can give me the list of equipment that I will need including the tap and a side glass. I have seen some posts which prohibit some types of materials which are toxic and I am a bit confused. Do you buy your materials from ebay or do you just pop into wickes and job is done?

Also, which drill bits would you use and how big holes does it need?

I am sorry for my ignorance but this will be my first project!

Thank you very much in advance.

[Mther]

I might asked too many questions and no one is bothered to answer:)

I managed to find most of the things. My question is, where do I get the taps from? Ebay or wickes or any other store? Which is cheaper? Does anyone have a link?

Also which materials (harmful) do we avoid to use? Is brass ok?

Thanks

[oakwell]

have a look here
http://www.themaltmiller.co.uk/index.ph ... t&catId=16

[Fil]

afaik the problem with some brassware is its designed for use with gas pipe work and not water so its not suitable for pottable (drinling water) water and can leach lead into the beer if used. buying brasware from ebay china is therfore a bit of a punt, but using water plumbware sourced from a uk supplier should be fine..

If using SS pot/keg, most look at using SS fittings too tho that does push the cost of the build up- a bit, bes.com or .co.uk ste a good source of SS fittings the site isnt the best, and if its a problem to navigate email em for a free catalouge to browse at your leisure.. They dont sell SS washers so gto to ebay for m20 SS washers

using SS pipe fittings to plumb up holes for valves etc can be done in a few ways,
or the malt miller link above has a SS bulkhead fitting to make things easy, also check out the homebrewbuilder.co.uk - its run by member mrlard to buy or enquire ring/email or pm him in here with your order/questions and for a delivery price and payment options, dont be put of cos the site isnt set up for e commerce,
he is a grand chap and stands behind his quality products..

as for the plan.. i have my doubts the coating will be an easy strip job, and will leave u with one hell of a polishing job??

and the extra thickness of the keg wall will present a cutting problem and holes will probably need these http://www.starrett.co.uk/shop/holesaws ... _hole_saw/
to cut valve/probe holes with a bloody good drill.

good luck with it tho and i hope u post pics of the progress its an ambitious build, but has the capacity for giving u a grand brew kit..

[barneey]

Just one thing are those kegs stainless or alu?

[asd]

I might asked too many questions and no one is bothered to answer:)


Also which materials (harmful) do we avoid to use? Is brass ok?

Thanks

Brass is OK if you "pickle" it first.

"Cleaning Brass
Some brewers use brass fittings in conjunction with their wort chillers or other brewing equipment and are concerned about the lead that is present in brass alloys. A solution of two parts white vinegar to one part hydrogen peroxide (common 3% solution) will remove tarnish and surface lead from brass parts when they are soaked for 5 minutes or less at room temperature. The brass will turn a buttery yellow color as it is cleaned. If the solution starts to turn green and the brass darkens, then the parts have been soaking too long and the copper in the brass is beginning to dissolve, exposing more lead. The solution has become contaminated and the part should be re-cleaned in a fresh solution." - From John Palmer's website/book.

[Mther]

Wow thank you so much for the infos guys.

Barney they are stainless steel.

Oakwell thanks for the site, but is it a bit expensive or these are the prices in market? I thought a tap would be 20 pounds max. However these taps look a bit more complicated. What is the advantage of the 3 piece ones? Is it just that I can de assemble for easier cleaning? Will the 2 piece do the job? With the extras I mean.

Thank you very much for all these infos Fil, I really appreciate that. I will check out the website you suggested, and write down a list. The coating looks a hard job, so probably I will use an element for the HLT and gas for the kettle. However the kegs surface is not too straight for the element to fit perfectly, so i might bang it and see what happens. I will let you know. First I need to find an Angle grinder to open the top:) thank you!

Cheers guys!

[Mther]

I might asked too many questions and no one is bothered to answer:)


Also which materials (harmful) do we avoid to use? Is brass ok?

Thanks

Brass is OK if you "pickle" it first.

"Cleaning Brass
Some brewers use brass fittings in conjunction with their wort chillers or other brewing equipment and are concerned about the lead that is present in brass alloys. A solution of two parts white vinegar to one part hydrogen peroxide (common 3% solution) will remove tarnish and surface lead from brass parts when they are soaked for 5 minutes or less at room temperature. The brass will turn a buttery yellow color as it is cleaned. If the solution starts to turn green and the brass darkens, then the parts have been soaking too long and the copper in the brass is beginning to dissolve, exposing more lead. The solution has become contaminated and the part should be re-cleaned in a fresh solution." - From John Palmer's website/book.

This is a very useful advice! Thank you!

[Mther]

Fil, the link who suggested for drilling holes says maximum thickness of 2mm. I was thinking of a cone drill bit:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_trksi ... &_from=R40
Not sure which drills ss but I will ask the sellers. Do you think it is a bad idea?

Also, regarding the hop and grain strainers, where and why do I use false bottom and where do I use the ss tube with the wholes? Thanks

[asd]

[quote="Mther"]Wow thank you so much for the infos guys.

Barney they are stainless steel.

Oakwell thanks for the site, but is it a bit expensive or these are the prices in market? I thought a tap would be 20 pounds max. However these taps look a bit more complicated. What is the advantage of the 3 piece ones? Is it just that I can de assemble for easier cleaning? Will the 2 piece do the job? With the extras I mean.


Cheers guys![/quote
Hi, I think in homebrewing, you don't really need a three piece. They are for use in pipework runs which cannot be easily dismantled. They do look nice, though!

[Frothy]

If your looking at taps for under £20 I use 1/2" BSP tank connectors (brass) and 1/2" ball valves.
Both available from your local plumbing shop and easily cope with the temperatures involved.

[Fil]

Fil, the link who suggested for drilling holes says maximum thickness of 2mm. I was thinking of a cone drill bit:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_trksi ... &_from=R40
Not sure which drills ss but I will ask the sellers. Do you think it is a bad idea?

Also, regarding the hop and grain strainers, where and why do I use false bottom and where do I use the ss tube with the wholes? Thanks

Fraid my experience with drilling SS is limited to the thin stockpot walls, the tungsten coated step drill bits work well when cooled and used with short pulses (1 sec on) in an electric drill. battery drills allow u to dril Very slowley and can if nervouse about overheating while drilling let you make a real meal out of the job, when i switched to a 400w mains dril for a pilot hole it was thru before i had time to think about it,, but again we are talking thin walls. if u drill without short pulses with a stepper bit u will burn off the coating in no time rendering it useless,,

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=62694&hilit=+drill

afaik the starrett tct cutters are superior to the bimetal hole saws, but with thick walls you will need cooling oil, and while wd40 is adiquate to cool a stepper bit when going thru a thin wall for a thick job i would invest in the real thing..

If you have a local workshop near by? you might be able to wave a couple of beer tokens under the nose of a pro metal worker and get the holes cut for you in the lunch hour?? its worth an ask ....

[Mther]

Thanks asd, Frothy and Fil!

Is 1/2' the size that everyone uses?

Fil, I thought of taking it to a workshop, but I think it will save money and give me more pleasure (lets say) if I build it by my self

After lots of googling I realised that turning the coated keg into HLT wont be easy job because the base of the keg is round so if I try to remove the plastic it wont be stable. I really want to avoid the use of element, but for now I think I will use the 100 litres, non coated keg as an HLT and kettle. Until I find a solution with the element, or maybe just sell the keg and buy a non coated for HLT.

[asd]

I've been thinking about this project. I've got a few of those kegs, I've also got a few "ordinary" stainless kegs (all legally acquired). I made a system a couple of years ago with some stainless kegs. I then went on and made a system from Nordic pots. It was such a relief and enlightenment! So easy! You can cut the steel without hassle, using a Qmax cutter - plus the smooth Nordic pots clean so easily! I really wish I'd kept ALL my kegs for dispensing from.

I don't really think you need the Thermopots everyone goes on about for mash tuns. You just wrap a couple of camping mattresses around a standard Nordic vessel, and you have the same effect.

My conclusion is, Don't make a brewery from kegs - use them for dispensing from - that is what they are designed for. You will have a devil of a job cutting holes in a "normal" keg, let alone a rubber/plastic coated one. Make your brewery from Nordic pots , or from blue plastic. Blue plastic is good (up to a point)!! Use your kegs to serve the beer from.

[asd]

Thanks asd, Frothy and Fil!

but for now I think I will use the 100 litres, non coated keg as an HLT and kettle. Until I find a solution with the element, or maybe just sell the keg and buy a non coated for HLT.

Where does the 100 litres, non coated keg come into it? I must have missed that.