Muntons & Woodforde's kits sticking

StrangeBrew · Post by **StrangeBrew** » Thu Nov 23, 2006 10:27 pm

There seems to be a lot of discussion and questions being asked on here and other forums about problems with these two makers of kits sticking. Is purely a coincidence or could it possibly be something to do with the fact that they are both produced by the same company?

Does anyone actually have consistently good results using any of these kits?

I've just brewed a Woodforde's Wherry and it's now in the barrel after it struggled to get down to 1017 and after reading about many others having similar problems, I'm a little put off trying other kits that were on my list like, Smugglers or Nelson Revenge and now find myself looking to other kit producers for my next brew.

Could this sticking problem be improved by better aeration of the wort and doubling up on the yeast from the start?

Vossy1 · Post by **Vossy1** » Thu Nov 23, 2006 11:46 pm

I've done a few Woodforde's Nelsons Revenge and never had any problems, just great beer

Steeev · Post by **Steeev** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 8:30 am

I've had a Wherry and Nelson's Revenge stick at around 1020.
I'm sure aeration wasn't the problem too, as I physically picked my fermenter up and shook the hell out of it (a good 4 inch foam left on top after all that)

I also had a max/min thermometer and the fermenter was kept within the temperature range at all times.

Safale done the business both times, although neither got lower than 1014.

Bottom line: They both turned out cracking despite the problems!

bitter_dave · Post by **bitter_dave** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 8:45 am

Steeev wrote:Safale done the business both times, although neither got lower than 1014.

Sounds like it's to do with the yeast in Muntons and Woodforde's kits.

Never heard of this happening with Brupaks kits, although they are also made by Muntons, and I'm sure Daab has said they use safale.

Have a look at this quote from the Muntons website:

For recipes demanding the use of sugar our Standard Yeast is ideal. If all malt brewing is undertaken we would recommend that you use our Premium Gold Yeast as our Standard Yeast will struggle to ferment some of the more complex sugars which are more prevalent in all malt recipes.

The major benefit for you of using Muntons Standard Yeast is its relatively low cost.

All of our yeasts are supplied in six gramme sachets sufficient to brew five U.K.gallons, six U.S. gallons or twenty three litres of beer.

Our Muntons Standard Yeast has been the mainstay of our beer kits for many years.

So they are selling all malt kits with a yeast which they don't recommend you use with all malt beers, in packages just over half the size of safale

bitter_dave · Post by **bitter_dave** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 8:54 am

.... If this hasn't already been done, I suggest someone e-mails Muntons and asks them which yeast they use for their beers, without mentioning why they are asking. If they say Muntons standard yeast I say quote the website back at them - if this is what they are doing, they should not be selling a premium all malt kit with a budget yeast not suitable for the task. Also let them know that it is in their interests to change their yeast - beerkits can get a bad name quickly on the internet as many people are bound to look at forums before they decide which ones to buy.

Aaaahhh, I'm turning into Anne Robinson

eskimobob · Post by **eskimobob** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 9:19 am

bitter_dave wrote:Aaaahhh, I'm turning into Anne Robinson

steve_flack · Post by **steve_flack** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 9:48 am

If you want a drier beer then Nottingham will ferment down a bit further. It's a little bit bland but settles well and will work at slightly lower temps than Safale so might be handy if you ferment somewhere cold. It's also a pretty cheap yeast.

flything · Post by **flything** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 12:09 pm

The Great Eastern Ale that is almost finished is the my best brew to date, really nice, reminiscent of London Pride (oddly), definately going to give one of their others ago especially as the LHBS sells them for 14.95 each.

StrangeBrew · Post by **StrangeBrew** » Sat Nov 25, 2006 11:00 am

It seems obvious that people have had varying results with these kits, do you think it might be down to the way the yeast (original supplied or replacement Safale etc) has been stored since production?

I was reading on the Fermentis site and they recommend that their yeast be stored in cool, dry conditions (<10c) and the recommended shelf life is 24 months under these recommended conditions. Can these storage conditions be guaranteed after production when the yeast has been sitting on a shop shelf or at home in our cupboards?

Would it be worth trying a yeast like Safbrew S-33 which can tolerate a higher alcohol content?

Maybe I'm just talking a load of waffle

steve_flack · Post by **steve_flack** » Sat Nov 25, 2006 11:52 am

I keep all my yeast in the fridge. I know most homebrew shops don't but I buy mine from Hop and Grape so at least they have a quick turn over.

bitter_dave · Post by **bitter_dave** » Sun Nov 26, 2006 12:43 pm

How many grams of yeast do you get in a packet of Muntons gold? Perhaps, if you get less than safale (11g), and the kits are not stored in cool conditions, the viability of the yeast will be too low? I have no idea, it's just a suggestion. I've bought most of my yeast - safale 04 - from my LHBS, which does not refridgerate the yeast, and had no problems - perhaps because the sachets are larger and can therefore stand some loss of viability?

Horden Hillbilly · Post by **Horden Hillbilly** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 8:38 pm

I have bought a woodfordes wherry kit for the first time recently, I normally do an ag brew but I have been working 6 days a week recently (darn Christmas rush!) so hopefully this will tie me over. I started it yesterday & after reading about the "stuck fermentation" problems people have been having I decided to do a yeast starter at around 9:00 am, by 8:00 pm it was fizzing away madly so I decided to do the brew there & then as I originally planned to do it tonight.

My fv was already sterilised as I had bottled 5 gallons of an ag brew which I intend to keep for the summer, I sterilised the bottles in the fv, therefore it was just a matter of heating water to mix the cans of wort in & topping up with cold water, all done & dusted by 8:45 pm, I also gave it a thorough stirring with a plastic paddle to areate it.

I checked the brew at 7:00 am today before I set off to work & there was a thin film of yeast forming, when I checked tonight at 6:00 pm the yeast was touching the lid on my fv!

I hope the brew turns out as good as it smells, it smells lovely! I will keep you posted on its progress.

I noticed that the kit had a best before date of 31st October 2008, so it is obviously fresh.

mysterio · Post by **mysterio** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 9:14 pm

I use Muntons premium gold yeast sometimes and it's good stuff. The Muntons gold kits aren't up to much in my experience though.

Horden Hillbilly · Post by **Horden Hillbilly** » Sat Dec 09, 2006 5:35 pm

Looks like it is now fermented as the hydrometer reading has been 1015 for the last 24 hours now, although there is still a very slight sign of white froth on the surface of the brew. I am going to leave it another 24 hours before I drop it into my king keg.

I must admit that I am surprised that it did not go lower than 1015, I did a yeast starter & a thorough rousing to areate it.

seawolf · Post by **seawolf** » Sun Dec 10, 2006 8:57 am

smuggles..................majic

old conkerwood...............bloody lovely

but both kits didnt go below 1015

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Muntons & Woodforde's kits sticking

Muntons & Woodforde's kits sticking