Topping Up FV

[alwilson]

Hi All,

I hope you're not bored of my constant questions!

This is more theoretical, as I have no intention of doing, well not yet anyway. But it started off as conversation with my brew-partner.

What happens if you top up an FV that's already got wort fermenting in there, say for 5 days with new freshly boiled/chilled wort, and pitch more yeast?

So say we mash, boil, hop and ferment for 1 week. 23 Liters.
Then a week later we do the exact same thing but top up the same FV with the wort, and pitch more yeast.

What would the outcome of that be, just filth?

Any thoughts welcome

Cheers,
Alex

[boingy]

I'm afraid the outcome would be very bad indeed.
We would report you to the beer police and you would be arrested and sectioned for crimes against underage beer.
It will seem harsh to you but I can assure you it would be in the best interests of the brewing hobby in the long run...

Seriously, why would you want to do that????

[RichardG]

Is there anything behind the question; maybe some sort of early thoughts on an experiment? I ask as you've said at the outset that you aren't going to do this, and as boingy as noted, why would you? I'm curious that's all, because the seemingly maddest ideas can have a kernal of genius in them sometimes.

[dave-o]

I can't see why it wouldn't work. I don't think you'd need to pitch more yeast though.

[Aleman]

German brewers do indeed do something very similar to this, in that they mash boil cool and transfer to the FV one day, pitch teh yeast, and the following 24/36 hours they mash again and transfer the fresh wort onto the already fermenting beer. . . . after about a week I'm not sure that it would be a good idea . . . for an ale . . . I've done the same thing for my German Pilsner . . . make up a 20L batch . . . ferment for 5 days then pitch the whole lot into another 70L of fresh wort . . . . sort of a 'large' starter really

[befuggled]

This is actually somewhat similar to how White Shield is made, but I can't find the reference at the mo.

It might have been posted by Pantsmachine, or I saw it in a video he linked to??

Someone....help!

[alwilson]

Is there anything behind the question; maybe some sort of early thoughts on an experiment?

Hi Richard,

Well, Yes. The idea actually started when I was baking bread last night, and ladled out a 100-odd ml of sourdough starter, that I have been looking after for about 3 months. And the longer I've kept it, the better the flavour of the final bread has become.

So, that was leading to, should I then reserve (or steal) some of the already fermenting beer to add to the next batch of beer I make.

I know Whisky distillers do a similar thing.


Alex

[RichardG]

Ahhh... now that's interesting. It seems that some of the commercial breweries do this, so I guess the thing is to give it a try (maybe on a smaller scale?) and see how it comes out.

[alwilson]

About 2 litres per 21l of wort?

[Spud395]

I believe Guinness do a process very similar to your sourdough.

They have a sourmash on the go and add some to the fresh beer or wort cant remember now.

Cant seem to find a link to where I read this now, I'll be back.

[trucker5774]

I also seem to remember a recent post. Someone on a brewery trip? The brewery did a cycle of top ups. My only thought would be at what point you could do it.............would adding more yeast be a problem in an already alcoholic environment? Done at the right time and transferred to another FV as the brewery did would be something similar to adding fresh wort to the yeast cake from a just completed brew. There may also be some effect on the body and sweetness of the final beer depending on the yeast activity...................guess work, I know, but in the right direction. Winemakers also use a similar technique.

[Dr. Dextrin]

I've just done this (I think, if I've understood the question correctly). Due to a recipe cock-up my FV was full of wort at OG 1070 when it should have been OG 1055. That didn't leave enough room to dilute the wort down, so...

I froze the excess. Then diluted what was left in the FV and fermented it. Once it had hit final gravity, I bottled some of it. Next, I thawed, boiled and cooled the frozen wort and topped up the FV with it. This has now just about fermented out so I've got a full FV of beer plus the bottles and not a drop of wort wasted.

As fas as I can tell at this stage, the result is indistinguishable from beer.

I can't think why you'd want to do this normally, though.

[trucker5774]

Well done Doc. I wouldn't have thought of doing that. I would have guzzled stronger beer Two brews from one I suppose you could say. I don't have the facilities for freezing any great amount

[Kev888]

I've done something 'similar' to the concept, by leaving some of the yeast and so inevitably a bit of beer in after mostly emptying the FV, and then pouring the new batch on top. It seems to get things going nicely, and I believe there's a theory that you evolve yeast most suited to your brewing conditions over time. If there's a break in the brewing rota you can stick some yeast in a sterilised sealed pot in the fridge for a bit (think some people freeze it?)

But that said, I gave up the practice when some sort of contamination got in (I believe thats waht happened anyway) and ruined two batches in a row. Its so easy to just sprinkle on dried yeast that I haven't tried any other way for some years - in fact I suspect its inadvisable but I don't even bother with a starter these days and never seem to have a problem.

Cheers
Kev