Finings

[alwilson]

Evening All,

I'm a bit confused about finings, I used irish moss in the boil, which I thought would create a clear beer.. Well it hasn't and now after more reading it seems there are various levels of finings.

What I really want to achieve is a crystal clear beer, much like something commercial. How would I acheive this. I read lots of threads about protofloc, isinglass and irish moss. But cant quite piece together how these all work, and whether they work with each other.

If I use isinglass, do I also use irish moss in the boil.
Is protofloc just irish moss in a tablet form?
Do I fine in the primary fermenter, or do I need to wait for hte secondary.

Any help is appreciated, thanks guys..

I've attached my first AG brew ( a tea clone) presented next to a commercial TEA.



Thanks all for your help,
Alex

[Befuddler]

The best fining is time. Different yeasts take different amounts of time to drop out, but pretty much anything will come clear eventually. I had one brew with Windsor take 4 months to drop bright, but it was f*cking fantastic when it did.

[alwilson]

do you mean in bottles, or in some other kind of vessel?

[Befuddler]

do you mean in bottles, or in some other kind of vessel?

That Windsor brew of mine was in a keg but the same holds true for bottles, it just doesn't take as long. If I read your other thread correctly, you've only had that TEA in the bottle for about 2 weeks? Come back to it in a month and it will probably be perfectly clear and much tastier.

[alwilson]

ah okay - so it really takes a month to come into condition in bottles then?

Incidentally, I've set aside a batch of 10 that havent been primed, just bottled and was going to give them a month to condition. Mostly as an experiment.

[Befuddler]

ah okay - so it really takes a month to come into condition in bottles then?

It depends on the strength of the beer.. The rule I follow is one week per 10 points of OG, so a beer of 1.050 would get at least 5 weeks to condition. More is better though, within reason. I'm making an imperial stout in the next couple of weeks with an estimated 1.105 OG, I'm not touching that til Christmas.

If you want something quick to tide you over, make a hefeweizen.. A lot of the character of that style comes from the yeast still in suspension, so it's better to drink them quickly. I've just done one that went from mashing to drinking in 2 weeks.

[Wolfy]

Different finings work in different ways and are for different purposes.
If you can work out what is causing the unwanted haze in your beer you can then decide on the best course of action.
Is it yeast in suspension or protein/chill haze that you are seeing for example?
If you chill the beer really cold for a few days/week does the haze get worse or better?

As others have suggested it may just be yeast in suspension, and if so time is one of the best things you can use to fix the problem.

[alwilson]

That's a good point, regarding chill haze.

There was definitely a noticeable difference between the chilled bottle (3 hours in the fridge) and the one opened at room temperature.
Though they BOTH were misty.

I hear of some people on here putting finings in the secondary FV - what type of haze would this clear? What finings would I use for this?

thanks,
Alex

[Wolfy]

I hear of some people on here putting finings in the secondary FV - what type of haze would this clear? What finings would I use for this?

I personally use gelatin in secondary to help drop out the yeast, however I believe you can also use specialty fining products to help drop out the proteins that cause chill haze.

[Fallen]

Have a read through this:

http://www.practicalbrewing.co.uk/fining/index.html

Should give you most of the info you'll need

[alwilson]

Will do, cheers Fallen.

Alex

[alwilson]

Whats everyone's thoughts on isinglass for fining with. The fining article mentioned by Fallen doesn't rate it too well, is that the general experience on here?

I'm using a teaspoon of irish moss in the boiler at T-5, does anyone recommend protafloc/whirlfloc instead? Followed by Gelatin in the secondary, 24 hours before bottling? Or longer?

I'd ideally like to achieve a beer as clear as a commercial beer?

thanks
Alex

[steve_flack]

I've come up with a process that gives chill haze free beer. It isn't one for the purists though.

I use a conical fermenter which makes the various yeast pulls etc a lot easier.

1) Ferment beer as normal (40L in my case)
2) Diacetyl rest at primary fermentation temperature for 1 day.
3) Pull yeast for re-use or to throw it away.
4) Dry Hop (if you're doing it) with pellets for three days.
5) Pull hops/yeast
6) Chill as far as you can (I get to around 5-7C at the moment).
7) Add polyclar (10g made up in 150ml of boiled water). Swirl
Let settle for 2 days. Pull.
9) Add 1 pint isinglass (made from either Alkleer C or the Caskleer paste - H&G sell the former, Brupacks stockists the latter).
10) Pull yeast every day until rack to bottles or keg. It should be really bright when casking/bottling. I reseed my bottles with a little fresh yeast (S-04) and some primings. This gives a little sediment but it's very stable and ensures quick carbonation.

Seems like a lot of faff but really doesn't take that long. Basically the beer is in the fermenter for a fortnight.

BTW, I've tried Gelatine. Sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't for me. Fresh Isinglass works everytime.

[DarloDave]

Do you find 3 days is enough dry hop? I thought 10-14 days was recommended?

[Wolfy]

BTW, I've tried Gelatine. Sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't for me. Fresh Isinglass works everytime.

I think that 'fresh' is the key when using Isinglass though, in many cases its not as fresh as it should be by the time the 'average' home brewer gets to use it.