Beer With No Name (Brew report)

[full malty]

Bank Holiday Monday is brewday !

I smacked the pack on a Wyeast 1318 London Ale III Yeast on Thursday, stepped it up on Saturday.

Wyeast 1318 is allegedly from Young’s brewery.

Described as “from a traditional London Brewery with great malt and hop profile. True top cropping strain, fruity, very light, soft balanced palate, finishes slightly sweet“.

Today’s brew was the first attempt at water chemistry or water treatment, in other words, I wanted to add some mineral salts to the water to improve the brew.

So, here’s a summary :

10 gallon brew length; 26 litres of mash liquor
Mash thick at high 60s celsius for 90 minutes
Batch sparged
Boil 120m
Ingredients : around 10kg of pale malt (freshly crushed this morning ; 1kg crystalt malt; 500g torrefied wheat
100g Target (11% aa) hops full wort hopped
85g Hilary Hops at Switch-Off
Nice healthy starter of around two pints

And for the water treatment, I added the following to the grain before mashing :

15g calcium chloride
15g gypsum
1 teaspoon magnesium sulphate/epsom salts
1.5 teaspoon common salt

Casked one firkin of Stout.

Kegged another keg ‘pin’ of Stout.

Kegged another 3 gallons of citrussy Lager… OVERLY dry hopped in a King Keg with Saaz.

I hope this new yeast rocks… as I’d like to re-use it a couple of times.

Wort seemed cloudy brown going into FV.

I used a dash of antifoam.

Fingers crossed !


:rolleyes:


http://blog.aberdare.org/

[Jim]

That sounds like a lot of water treatment, FM. What kind of water do you have out of the tap?

Keep us posted with progress on this one. I'm particularly interested to see how your fermentation goes with the London III; mine seemed quite slow (but steady) at around 19 - 20C, and didn't seem to clear as well as my Gervin Ale used to (yet it's supposed to have high flocculation).

[full malty]

QUOTE (jim @ Aug 30 2005, 06:50 AM)That sounds like a lot of water treatment, FM. What kind of water do you have out of the tap?

Keep us posted with progress on this one. I'm particularly interested to see how your fermentation goes with the London III; mine seemed quite slow (but steady) at around 19 - 20C, and didn't seem to clear as well as my Gervin Ale used to (yet it's supposed to have high flocculation).
The water here is soft, suitable for lager untreated... I've added principally calcium chloride to improve malt profile and gypsum to improve hop profile. A little salt for taste and mouthfeel. I'm not sure what epsom salts contribute ?

Why do you think the water treatment I mentioned is too much for 45 litres ? How much would you use Jim ?

Bear in mind I'm a complete newbie at treatment so trying to tread prudently.

One of the opinions I received from the http://www.smartgroups.com/groups/uk-homebrew was that my water treatment was too little as I was treating for mash liquor and not overall brew volume.

I'm fermenting this brew colder than the recommended temperature range. It's in the brewshed. So it's warm today, but gets colder at night. It's bubbling away vigourously.

As I used a little antifoam in the fermentor, it's not foaming all over the place.

I'm generally happy with the brew so far. I used a lot of CRYSTAL because I want that toffee flavour, colour and residual sweetness. I mashed high 60s to get a beer with better body.

[Jim]

Well, I have moderately hard water, which is mostly permanent hardness (i.e. not too many carbonates). I add about 5g of gypsum to 5 gall and nothing else. As your water is very soft, it can stand more sulphates, and 15 g in 10 gall should be fine; however, since you are just adding it to the mash liquor, it may give you too low a pH (higher acidity) in the mash, resulting in the wort being more attenuative.

I would also use common salt (sodium chloride) with caution, as I've read that it can have an adverse effect on yeast growth. Also, most tap waters have some in to start with. Calcium chloride has a similar effect on flavour and is, I believe what commercial breweries tend to use instead (although it also increases acidity in the mash).

Epsom salts, on the other hand, is good for the yeast, though too much can give the beer a slightly harsh, bitter taste. It also has a similar effect on pH to gypsum, so I think you should check your mash pH next time you brew!

Here are a few links on brewing water that I have found useful:


http://www.beer-brewing.com/brewing_water.htm

http://www.brookes.ac.uk/geology/8361/1 ... /water.htm

I would also have a look at the chapter on water treatment in David Line's "Big Book of Brewing".


Err, and don't try to stand up too suddenly after a few pints of that beer; I work out the OG at around 65 to 70 !!

Cheers,
Jim

[full malty]

QUOTE (jim @ Aug 30 2005, 05:52 PM)Well, I have moderately hard water, which is mostly permanent hardness (i.e. not too many carbonates). I add about 5g of gypsum to 5 gall and nothing else. As your water is very soft, it can stand more sulphates, and 15 g in 10 gall should be fine; however, since you are just adding it to the mash liquor, it may give you too low a pH (higher acidity) in the mash, resulting in the wort being more attenuative.

I would also use common salt (sodium chloride) with caution, as I've read that it can have an adverse effect on yeast growth. Also, most tap waters have some in to start with. Calcium chloride has a similar effect on flavour and is, I believe what commercial breweries tend to use instead (although it also increases acidity in the mash).

Epsom salts, on the other hand, is good for the yeast, though too much can give the beer a slightly harsh, bitter taste. It also has a similar effect on pH to gypsum, so I think you should check your mash pH next time you brew!

Here are a few links on brewing water that I have found useful:


http://www.beer-brewing.com/brewing_water.htm

http://www.brookes.ac.uk/geology/8361/1 ... /water.htm

I would also have a look at the chapter on water treatment in David Line's "Big Book of Brewing".


Err, and don't try to stand up too suddenly after a few pints of that beer; I work out the OG at around 65 to 70 !! 

Cheers,
Jim
Thanks for your comments Jim. Very interesting reply you sent.

I'm new to this water chemistry thing, but I'm an enthusiastic learner.

Regarding the original gravity of this beer, it's the one thing I FORGOT to do.. take a reading. I was tired and forgot to do it.

I try to brew beers around 4% ABV. I don't see the point brewing anything less than this as a craft brewer.

If this brew turns out OK, I will try to cask it for Christmas. So a 5%+ ABV is not a problem !

[Reg]

Santa will be pleased!!!

So did you try and come up with something similar to a Youngs brew, looking at some of the ingredients, it would seem that you did???

[jean-yves]

Hi Full Malty,

your beer sound strange for me :huh:
as you , I brew 50 liter per batch, but I use less malt (about 9-10 kg) , less hop your beer should be strong and very bitter about 48-50 ebu,for the water treatment I use 6 gr of calcium chloride and 8 gr of sulphate chloride, with this I've a ph of 5.3-5.5.

I agree with Jim, you should check your ph; if your ph is too low it will produce a harsh bitter taste to the ale.

Hope you'll get a good beer

[full malty]

QUOTE (Reg @ Aug 31 2005, 08:27 AM) Santa will be pleased!!!

So did you try and come up with something similar to a Youngs brew, looking at some of the ingredients, it would seem that you did???
No, I didn't try to emulate a Young's beer.

I wanted to aim for around 5% ABV. I wanted a decent mouthfeel and some residual sweetnes, so I used crystal for sweetness and mashed thick etc.

[full malty]

QUOTE (jean-yves @ Aug 31 2005, 09:44 PM) Hi Full Malty,

your beer sound strange for me :huh:
as you , I brew 50 liter per batch, but I use less malt (about 9-10 kg) , less hop your beer should be strong and very bitter about 48-50 ebu,for the water treatment I use 6 gr of calcium chloride and 8 gr of sulphate chloride, with this I've a ph of 5.3-5.5.

I agree with Jim, you should check your ph; if your ph is too low it will produce a harsh bitter taste to the ale.

Hope you'll get a good beer
I'm enjoy beers with a bitter bite

100g of Target in a 45 litre brew is mild for me.

I like truly soporific beers.

[Jim]

QUOTE (full malty @ Sep 1 2005, 12:49 AM) QUOTE (jean-yves @ Aug 31 2005, 09:44 PM) Hi Full Malty,

your beer sound strange for me :huh:
as you , I brew 50 liter per batch, but I use less malt (about 9-10 kg) , less hop your beer should be strong and very bitter about 48-50 ebu,for the water treatment I use 6 gr of calcium chloride and 8 gr of sulphate chloride, with this I've a ph of 5.3-5.5.

I agree with Jim, you should check your ph; if your ph is too low it will produce a harsh bitter taste to the ale.

Hope you'll get a good beer
I'm enjoy beers with a bitter bite

100g of Target in a 45 litre brew is mild for me.

I like truly soporific beers.
And that's the beauty of our hobby; you can brew the beer you like, not the beer some brewery accountant thinks you should like!

B)

[jean-yves]

QUOTE (jim @ Sep 2 2005, 05:08 PM) QUOTE (full malty @ Sep 1 2005, 12:49 AM) QUOTE (jean-yves @ Aug 31 2005, 09:44 PM) Hi Full Malty,

your beer sound strange for me :huh:
as you , I brew 50 liter per batch, but I use less malt (about 9-10 kg) , less hop your beer should be strong and very bitter about 48-50 ebu,for the water treatment I use 6 gr of calcium chloride and 8 gr of sulphate chloride, with this I've a ph of 5.3-5.5.

I agree with Jim, you should check your ph; if your ph is too low it will produce a harsh bitter taste to the ale.

Hope you'll get a good beer
I'm enjoy beers with a bitter bite

100g of Target in a 45 litre brew is mild for me.

I like truly soporific beers.
And that's the beauty of our hobby; you can brew the beer you like, not the beer some brewery accountant thinks you should like!

B)
pas mieux Jim

[Jim]

QUOTE (jean-yves @ Sep 4 2005, 09:30 PM) ...pas mieux Jim
Oui, beacoup mieux!


(hope I got that right )

[jean-yves]

Jim, when I said "pas mieux" I mean that I agree with you and that I have nothing else better to reply at your quote

[Jim]

Whoops! :rolleyes:

[Andy]

Mangetout Rodders, mangetout.....